STEVEHOLS54

Maybe both Chris and Hans want to showcase for next season ?? Harris in respect of showing he is willing yet again to step in late and prove to Poole management he is worth considering for 2020 on his now much lower GSA. Remember it was his much higher GSA in 2018 stopped him getting a place in 2019. He knows he has a kind of cult status after the heroics of that one meeting alone against Somerset. Hans showing he is willing to drive 2 bikes to a meaningless meeting miles from his base where he may not even get a ride, but as a Poole asset he is again showing management he is willing to put himself out for both a meaningless meeting and as a kind of loyalty to Poole where he gets major sponsorship in the local area, in an attempt once again to show Matt he is worth considering for 2020 at such a falsely low GSA. I may we well wide of the mark but I am sure both would like to keep options open as much as possible to secure decent UK contracts for 2020 at a track both have ridden well over the years.

Skidder - We all know that Matt is a past master of playing the media to seek attention to the club. Today is no different. He commented in the last close season that due to at lack of a main team sponsor (at that time before the Carpet Cleaners signed up) that having embarked on his new career and in the absence of such sponsors he could not guarantee what the future held for the club if maybe a new buyer could not be found. This is a different spin on the same theme. Having said that I in no way want to distract from what must have been a very tense and financially difficult time for Poole. The release of this press release could also be viewed partly as an attempt to help swell the crowd on the basis that your vorte may well make a difference to where the club heads in respect of 2020. Personally I wish him all the best in trying to secure decent main sponsors in his quest to try and keep them in the Prem for the future. However at worse I would accept Champ rather than not running and as mentioned he has plenty of poss club asset options to perhaps put out a decent team in worse case scenario which would not break the Bank. Of course the other side of this is perhaps a well in advance let down notice to those amongst us who like playing the name next seasons team game. I can't see either Team Kevlars or some of the established foreigner riders or exciting young talent being considered if the club is on the rack somewhat financially. Maybe more of the same to come to keep costs down with MAYBE Holder Sr in the mix ?? Having said that would he not cost a packet if he still considers himself World Class and has to commute in if he no longer lives UK ??

Gav can you really see NKI putting in a full UK season ? The only reason he came back was because Torun were relegated (so season over)and he was not involved in SWE play off final so had time on his hands and lives mainly UK. Now he has qualified for SGP 2020 I can't see him killing himself to do 4 leagues again plus the SGP. I reckon he is not comfortable with the smaller sched of POL/SWE/DK/SGP plus his normal DL Championship & SGP qualifiers to get into the SGP as he knows he will struggle to make the top 8. Would like to see him back in UK but can only see it late in season at best. As for Jordan Stewart - Hey mate he was my idea as an under the radar promising possibility for Poole. Having said that with the latest from Ford on the parlous situation the clubs future maybe you should snap him up

I can imagine the loss is fairly substantial. If you look at the loss as per the Administrators Statement on 9th Aug that in in Itself showed £21k owed to Poole. Factor in no money for Aug/Sept/Oct from them plus the loss of a possible bumper final crowd loss against maybe Swindon that would have at least maybe offset a part of those losses then in Financial terms it has been a not great one. The falling crowds compared to years gone by also contributed. However let's also not lose sight of the fact that some years ago Matt sold his other biz interests and his main income I assume was from the successful years of SKY sponsorship and the likes of good money from the Readypower deal. I assume the club was profitable to enable that to happen. These are worrying times for a team which was on many occasions compared to the Man U of the Speedway World. Going to be interesting how this plays out considering Buster made the comment not that long ago regarding exciting plans for next season to be discussed/agreed at the next AGM. Fingers crossed something will happen to allow the club to continue in either or a combined league.

Maybe you partly hit the nail on the head with his hone (Ipswich) form. We all know that in the main his Poole home form would probably be well above that. Let's not forget the main reason he was not signed was because he had climbed to 7.59 which was too high to fit in with Ford's plans. It may well be true that both Harris and Hans Andersen are not the riders they were but the point I was eluding to is that IF Poole want to say accommodate Chris Holder and at the same time retain the nucleus of 4 out of 5 of both Holders/Kurtz/Klindt/Josh G then something has to give further down the team if we want to have any kind of reserves. Would the likes of Harris/Hans really be so bad as second strings with maybe also some up and coming young riders whether they be UK or Aussie. Ultimately and assuming Ford does not want to embark on massive investment again for foreign riders and all associated costs involved, then to a degree maybe his options are somewhat limited anyway bearing in mind the other 6 to 7/8/9 teams (depending on 2020 set up) will also be fighting to keep within the 42.50 limit. Just suggestions to cultivate ideas/opinions :-) When i look at the 2019 near enough final GSA's I think those riders on attractive GSA's like Morris/Douglas/Allen/Lidsey/Becker are going to be hard to prise away from existing clubs and as for any recognised heavy pointers, they will not be able to be accommodated due to their high GSA's.

I think in an ideal World Ford would like to have Chris Holder back and retain Jack/Brady/Nicolai & Josh. The problem with that idea is it comes to a combined GSA of 36.91 which would only leave 5.59 for the last 2 riders. That won't work if the min is 4 for riders unless a young Brit on 3.??. On that basis something has to give meaning at least one rider would need to be released from the 5 named. If you signed Harris at 6.16 or Hans And., at 5.79 as a replacement that would free up approx 1 to 1.5 points leaving still only 1.25 to 1.5 points so 6.59 to 7 ish for 2 riders at reserve which still arguably not enough. IF Chris is in the plans then it is still going to be interesting how the Ford's juggle the current riders GSA's to get the riders in on a 42.5 limit if it were to stay the same. If Ford and Middlo are already advanced on the team for 2020 then I am intrigued to see how things fall into place. One thing on Chris Holder though. Is he not UK based any more having moved to Andorra that Tax Haven a number of riders have discovered such as Lindgren. Would it mean flying in and out and finding accommodation ??. I assume if Jack is retained maybe Engineer & Accommodation costs could be shared ??. Just a thought. Having said that if as it seems he will be in SWE again next year (mainly Tue) then I suppose he can share traveling and staying with with Jack so not so much back and forth to Andorra ??

Assuming money is still tight, I honestly can't see Ford letting both Kurtz & Jack Holder go. Bearing in mind both are assets so Poole get first choice. IF Chris Holder is allowed back then Ford faces a difficult decision of perhaps which one of the above does he loan out. Assuming that is he were to retain Klindt and Josh G. Having said that who says he won't maybe sacrifice one of those last 2 in order to keep both Holders and Kurtz. Even if conventional logic from many fans is that Klindt and Josh G should be the first names on the team sheet for 2020.

A question and not meant to sow any mischief. Do we know for certain if Poole will be running in 2020 ??. I ask because Matt Ford was at one stage prior to the start of this saying in the Echo that he could not guarantee the situation after this season if a buyer could not be found. I would have thought that knowing how tight money was this year - lowish crowds - I assume a lot of the carpet cleaners money was used to shore up the shortfalls - factor in the loss of at least 3/4000 paying customers for a final (certainly if it was Swindon), has probably punched a largish hole in the anticipated revenue for 2019. I suppose where I am heading with this is will Poole definitely run in 2020 and will there be any money anyway to pay for a half decent team or will it be near enough all assets with the odd change. I accept that perhaps only a decent money bearing Team Sponsor will dictate on who he can/cannot sign but signs not that great when in reality he could not even afford to kit out the team in Kevlars for this season. I wonder if the Carpet Cleaners will go again after the challenges of this season as money in this sport is in short supply. Even then what they did put in was arguably eaten up with gate losses ?? Maybe those closer to the Club and more in the know may have some insight into the future ??

Long term I agree but if it comes down to cost and if he is an asset then from a team building exercise in itself, his 5.79 GSA COULD allow some extra wiggle room if trying to fit another strength in depth 3 to 4 x 7 plus point riders going forward, which I would expect will make up next seasons team if they also want strongish reserves. If he does rediscover his 7 plus points GSA then he could be a worthwhile signing. Maybe no longer a heat leader but for sure a very good (possibly) second string on that average. Just my opinion of course. But at least it's cultivating further discussion & opinion ;-)

Skidder - With respect. I support Poole but I am also interested when non Poole fans enter into interesting debate or offer both positive & negative comments in respect of opinion or team building. I accept that Steve Shovlar and Starman don't always get the best out of him in exchanges but that is because its like waving a red rag to a bull between them. That's one thing I have noticed in the last 3 years I have populated this forum. Personally he has always engaged with me when discussing speedway and we do not engage in comments re cheating/manipulation or anything other than sensible speedway exchanges. I can only comment from my perspective and that for me is good enough. For others - Well all I do is smile and have a giggle when the parties involved have their petulant exchanges :-)

Careful Gav, We do't want the mods finding a reason to block you off again ;-) You have the bragging rights this season so just rise above it. Having said that I sometimes wonder if you and Starman just love baiting each other at times :-) As usual I for one welcome your input into team building for any team. I know you have a good knowledge and spend numerous amounts of time accessing past stats etc which I for one find interesting.

Maybe Doyle looking for a less hectic and more settled lifestyle which POL/UK and the GP's would give him if you also factor in various Individual meetings. I can imagine its a hell of a lot of tiring commuting doing POl FRI or SUN/Swe Tue or the odd Thur plus UK mainly Thur & Mon. We know he lives in UK with his wife so chances are he is in like a revolving door with whistle stop visits home before he is off again. Is his schedule something like POL SUN or FRI - back to UK to maybe ride is some UK meetings or be at home - SWE Tue (odd Thur) back home for UK Thur and then back out again on Thur/Fri for GP warm ups and Sat GP's and then on to POL again for league meetings Sundays. Amazes me how the likes of NKI and Hans And did POL/UK/DK and SWE for so many years. Even NKI dropped one this season (UK) and only came back when he knew his GP place is secured for 2020 and Torun were not in play offs having been relegated, I know they are supposed to be professional sportsmen but these guys are normally flying on budget airlines getting little sleep and we all take for granted they will always be on top form to race and score big points.

The only reason I mention him is because he is on 5.79. What i ask myself is whether he is capable of say upping it to around 7 which is more nearer his fully fit mark. For team planning you can do a lot worse if trying to stay in the 42.5 limit (IF it stays the same). Personally I would like to see up and coming young riders from Pol/DK etc given a chance, but chances are Ford will not have the money to sign expensive young riders with all the flying/accom/mechanic costs involved. Similar to this year when he could not afford Woryna/Jakobsen etc. Ford was the one who said the deal with the Carpet Cleaners now allowed him to sign decent quality riders mid season if others were not performing or injuries (admitted that in the Echo). Now before anyone says none were available I think that is b.s. I think the poor crowds for many matches where it was near enough admitted they were losing money probably swallowed up most of that. As for the loss of the Final revenue it doesn't bear thinking about how that has blown a massive hole in the clubs pocket for this season and maybe next unless a decent main sponsor is secured. As for Harris & Nichols ?? - Again I only mention these kind of guys for team building if you are looking for a strong front end thus having these guys on a 5.79 to 6.16 GSA as second string riders who all ride Poole above that GSA and have the potential to load a point or so on their GSA. If the money for the real foreign talent is not there (which I assume it isn't) then these guys offer stability at low av with the potential to add a bit. Of course if you can give me riders who Poole can afford at these kind of GSA's with the ability to add on willing to sign then great. Maybe Jake Allen/Ryan Douglas but not many riding UK who you can see in that position. Morris will either stay at Wolves on that low GSA or go back to Swindon who need to shed 3.84 points and a straight move back there will give the saving if they are forced to sacrifice Batchelor who is 3.44 higher thus bringing back close to the 42.5 limit. As for my suggestion of Jordan Stewart. A young up and coming Aussie who perhaps has gone under the radar and not yet 21 until mid Nov. Only finishing his second season in UK. Could be worth a risk at reserve with potential IF they also have a decent other reserve such as Covati but that's just my opinion.

Do what the Poles do who had their season and finals done and dusted by 3rd/4th week of Sept. The UK drags on for too long and the weather spoils it not for the first time.

I think Hans Andersen could be an interesting option if he is a Poole asset. He started on a GSA of 7.56 and finished with what seems a crazy low of 5.79 having never really recovered from the bad crash and concussion which in effect wiped nearly 2 points of his av. Now we know a fully fit Hans is worth maybe up to 2 points more even if he is not the rider he once was. A very interesting perhaps false av for team building for sure. I can't see Poole dropping both Kurt & Holder jr irrespective of whether Holder Sr returns or not. However Chris returning could play some part in which of the two is loaned out maybe. Harris is another who has maybe dropped to a more attractive GSA of 6.16. Only reason Ford probably didn't sign him this season was because he shot up to 7.59 for season start. Again maybe worth more if one factors in he probably rides Poole (in any condition) better than most and also better than he rides Ipswich which helped drag his GSA down. Never been a big Worrall fan personally unless she was at reserve. His 5.22 GSA at least 0.26 lower than his starting which maybe reflective of at best that is his level. Would like to see Douglas who has improved and still sits on 4.66 final GSA. Shame a bit as his previous 4.26 really was a bargain. Still would be a VERY good reserve imo. One name I would like to throw in at reserve is young Aussie Jordan Stewart. Only turn 21 mid Nov and in his second UK season with Redcar. Currently on a Champ GRA of 5.74. Would that be calculated down for 2020 in Prem or does he get punished being an Aussie ??. I think he is improving and one to build on for the future if they can squeeze him into a reserve slot on a low GSA as think there is potential plus frees up some points further up the team. Maybe and ultimately a lot may come down to what money Ford will have available as he may be forced to use assets mainly anyway to save cost. That I suppose brings riders such as Wright into the discussion.

What would concern me is what financial state are Poole in. Was no secret Ford had no money and built his team based on assets and what cheap options he could afford. Along came the carpet cleaners but despite this they endured poor crowds at times and were losing money still. Also questionable if No1 CC paid their full sponsor agreement or did they come to a compromise with Ford just to tie over until season end after what seemed like a fall out in last 3rd of the season that even led to their logo coming off the Poole website. Factor is a relatively poor SF playoff crowd and what now must be a MASSIVE revenue loss from a PO Final against possibly Swindon which arguably must run into a tens of thousands hole from say a 3/4000 Final crowd. when they probably assumed they would walk into. Considering Ford wanted out but of course nobody will pay his over inflated price for the club, where does this place Poole for 2020 (depending that is on what the BSPA come up with for 2020). No real TV money worth talking about - maybe no decent money generating main sponsor ?? - possibly lower crowds ongoing plus importantly perhaps no money to invest in a team with a proven heat leader ?? Of course for 2020 there is also the Chris Holder problem. Will he be allowed to ride in UK or still months of will they won't they let him ride in UK. Then the question of HolderJr/Kurtz. Will Chris be happy if Jack was dumped out of the team and do what he was playing at before i.e trying to join little Bro at Somerset. Last night was a situation just waiting to happen. We had seen inconsistences all season with Holder/Kurtz and also with Wells and TJH in the latter part. Well last night all 4 bombed together. Plenty of Poole fans were concerned about Wells and TJH joining and those were well and truly hammered home last night. I agree with Poole Bolton re Klindt and Josh G and maybe Covati but more as a reserve for 2020. Must admit I normally get quite into guess the team for the following season, but where in seasons past Ford had a combo of both the Sky and the big Readypower deal, he no longer has that financial clout behind him. Also factor in he no longer has his focus in UK with his overseas venture, does concern me a little on what 2020 holds for Poole as a club and will it be a case of can't afford decent riders so very much of same again for next year (i.e assets only) except at reserve ??

Do guest appearances count in the calculation of GSA. ??. If it doesn't then it could be anyone's guess which Chris will turn up Thursday. Ironic if it is the first type of score rather than the latter one's ;-) Of course if they did then Chris will be very well aware his current GSA sits at a VERY attractive 6.16 on the last sheets and that makes his an attractive draw for any team building for 2020. Remember his starting 2019 was 7.59 which was the only reason Ford could not accommodate him for 2019. Had it been 6.19 I think he would have snapped him up. A number of Poole supporters and Ford himself I believe always said he planned well in advance for his team for the following season. Could it be that discussions may even have taken place with Harris re a possible team slot on that attractive 6.16 GSA ?? Based on also the fact that play offs do not count in GSA calculation. Much as Chris is a VERY up and down rider, he rides Poole well and I think his GSA would go up if he rejoined them in 2020. His better home form would drag up his GSA imo.

Interesting looking at Kurtz and Holder's scores last night. Correct me if I am wrong but is it the scores only achieved in the regular season that count for the GSA's for the following season ?? (i.e points scored in play offs do not count ??) - Believe bonus points do not count for the GSA calculation. Knowing that a home team scores 3 points irrespective of if they win by 1 point or 30 makes me think hmmm - I wonder if our 2 young Aussies are looking at the averages (or are being guided) for team building in 2020. Brady is on 7.39 wef 1/9 so a 4 point from 4 rides last night sure helps for next season. Jack is on 7.28 so again 8 from 5 rides = 6.4 from 4 on count back so again helps on lowering his GSA. I am probably way off the mark but when you think about it the lower your av is at this late stage when you are a rider of their calibre, the more attractive you become in team building plans for the following season ;-)

Skidder - I support Poole and Brady is a Poole rider so no problem in my book posting on Poole 2019. i have been shouting about how highly I rated Brady since he arrived here at 16. Early in that first season I even emailed Matt/the Club try and sign him up as looked a future World Star. I am not a Brady knocker. However whichever way you put it, other young stars seem to be developing quicker around Europe (incl in my book young Jack Holder) and he is if anything going a bit backwards which is what concerns me. Yes the POL EXL is brutal and maybe not so easy riding with Emil. However not every race he is paired with Emil plus other younger riders seem to be overtaking him progress wise. I 100% hope he does push on and maybe he is more of a slower developer having originally impressed so highly that the topPOL EXL team signed him on a long term contract and put him in their first team. However the fact is that after the baptism of fire of his initial season and getting used to all the commuting UK/POL/SWE he has not pushed on in my book. He is now coming to the end of his 6th Season riding in UK and is about to turn 23. Maybe a move away from being amongst so many top riders in one team may do his confidence some good but at the same time not so good for confidence if he does get dropped. Its a simple decision for Leszno of him or Hampel have to go so not as if that's an easy one. As for Poole his GSA is still decent enough to keep him as it has the potential to still improve in a grossly inferior league. The problem Poole will have is that IF Chris Holder is allowed back who would make way ???. Klindt has arguably been their best rider this season and swapping for Holder in my book won't strengthen them even if Holder has a POSSIBLY attractive 7.16 GSA. But that's a discussion for later ;-)

Well it looks to me that Brady Kurtz has probably and finally ridden himself out of the Leszno team for 2020. His form for them in 2019 has actually gone backwards compared to 2018. He sits 42nd in the POL EXL Av which when you consider there are only 7 teams that's some under achievement. I just saw the exciting first leg final on Youtube and he was dropped after 2 pointless rides where to be honest he looked outclassed and well off the pace. He is lucky that he has been carried by the best EXL team in years in Leszno (last year and this) so it has probably masked him being dropped earlier. For me, young as he still is there is something missing and i am starting to think that maybe he is ultimately a slightly just above average Aussie. Hope he proves me wrong long term. He is fortunate that Leszno signed him up on a multi year contract, but I think its nailed on he will be farmed out to another EXL team on loan or seeing his av, he maybe even dropped into the Lower League Nice 1 as his confidence looks gone. Even when gating he was easily overtaken. With Smektala moving into the main team in 2020 as no loner a junior I can't see him being given a spot in the main team for 2020. Some on this forum said over 2 seasons ago they thought Holder Jr maybe looked to have more potential and be the better rider despite having less experience in UK. On the World stage it looks like they may have been right.

Maybe Lambert did have a genuine reason for missing the flight such as a security delay (Maybe). It could be that he then decided the better of the 2 evils was to go home to Germany where he would be better positioned to get to the U21 Final rather then come into UK on another flight today (if possible even) and then fly out again for the U21 meeting in Germany. It's just the way it reads this late doesn't look to clever considering his geographical location to home in Germany from DK (where many can normally drive the distance) and where he is then better based to reach the U21 meeting. That's on top of seeing his girlfriend which another no doubt big bonus ;-)

Certainly not. It's indefensible as far as I am concerned. My comments were aimed at maybe where his loyalties lie these days and no way defends his actions. Just commenting as to another reason maybe why he's not come back. Stop off at their's in Germany and less travel for the U21 meeting. If true it is taking the pee out of UK Speedway.

Doesn't he also live in Germany with his girlfriend who is based there when he is not jetting around POL/SWE/DK/UK and as many individual Championships and meetings around Europe. I thought that was his base now. Maybe some quality time with her and with an upcoming U21 meeting in Germany more important to him than what for him and KL is now a pointless meeting at a track he has not exactly got a great love for after plenty of criticism from him on it over the last 2 seasons. Maybe it is only a matter of time before he does a Tai and maybe dumps UK with such a schedule in future years ??

Let's be clear. Both Jakobsen & Woryna were prepared to come back this year. It was he fact that Ford said he no longer had the money to sign overseas based riders and all costs involved for mechanics/airfairs/accomodation etc so kept to mainly Poole assets plus cheaper alternatives such as Worrall. As said he could probably have also signed Allen & Rasmus Jensen but once again went for the cheaper option of NBJ. Covatti was interesting as a reserve but again was a cheaper option being UK based and with him doubling up at Somerset thus reducing Ford's cost. However he shouldn't have then gone public after signing up with the carpet cleaners to openly state in the Echo that the deal now allowed him to make decent mid season signings should there be injuries or riders dropped due to poor performance. It's obvious that with what looks like some issues with the sponsors (one would assume from various comments made) and poor gates due to some poor team perfomances earlier, that said money was no longer available to invest in the team. These are more difficult times for Poole - No longer the big money sponsors like Readypower - No Sky money - falling gates - lower quality riders than in the past. Add to that Matt Ford openly wanting out of the club but of course nobody wants a club in a sport in demise in UK at a highly over inflated price. Maybe the fortune they had last year has flipped against them this year. No team has a given right to win the league every season. Holder & Kurtz inconsistences continue to plague the team as you never know if or when both will click. As for the future - who knows as much will depend on league set up - points limits - will Holder Sr return and who makes way and most importantly will the Ford's continue, plus with the issues of Team Sponsers this year what will happen going forward as major companies certainly have no major interest despite this being the affluent South Coast where millionaires in their many reside.

What do you expect from a Swindon supporter LOL The way things currently looking, Swindon won't need any big slices of luck to win the title/playoffs. Fair play to them for sensible and shrewd signings plus finally getting the best out of Perks. Only Wolves imo stand in your way.