Bleeds Pirate Blue

Very disappointing on both regards. Thanks for all the service Kyle. You're a Poole legend in the eyes of myself, and many others. I look forward to seeing you in the skull and crossbones again soon. This is nothing against Paul Starke mind, who has always been a pleasure to watch in Poole colours. As for closing down the Poole forum, well, that's simply laughable behaviour.

@Gavan Fair enough - thanks for the reasoned response, although as Nietzsche said, "There are no facts, only interpretations"

@Gavan What you classify as a "fact" is different to me then. What we have here opinions here from two long-suffering speedway fans (and other adding their two-pennies worth). Just so you know, it is okay to disagree about your perceptions of a rider's talent/ability with other fans of the sport. You don't have to take over a forum thread and bludgeon us all with the same info time and time again. Repeating something, or saying it even louder, doesn't further legitimise your position. Your evidence re: Josh Grajczonek neglected to mention he was a former Poole rider, so has plenty of home track experience for example. Or how, in my opinion, Freddie has been only so so at Poole in the past. For a rider of his calibre I'd have expected more from him on the numerous times I've seen him at Wimborne Road. As for Bates vs Klindt at the NSS, I haven't studied their scores there, but knowing Klindt (gater) and the track (amazing!) a trier like Bates would be the preferred option, but offers much more volatility in his scoring. So its youth, upside and inconsistency vs the more reliable, steady old-hand....

@Gavan You live in a very black and white world.

The first album never gets the respect it deserved... And, if I was to ever suggest a peacemaker between you two, perhaps Fred Durst can get the job done!!

Deliberate quote of Limp Bizkit!?

Fair enough. For what it's worth I am also of the opinion that Shanes' currently looks a little stiff on the bike around Poole. To my eyes he is adopting a grasstrack/longtrack style and riding a smooth and consistent line through the bends, which means he lacks the flexibility to react and changes lines to incidents in front of him etc... I've been going to speedway (and grasstack) for 27 years now, and many fans of the sport are equally long servants and supporters, so it's not unreasonable that we comment on a rider's style on a bike. I also think Shanes' echoes Steve Schofield's style somewhat, it's just last week it seemed more noticeable to me (and Steve!) that Shanes was a little rigid on the bike. I'm a huge fan of Shanes', and certainly want to see him given every opportunity to succeed as a Pirate. Sacking him as part of any team change would be a short-sighted change and not one I'd approve of. Any critique given is done so with his best interests at heart. As you state, we've never sat on a bike and turn a wheel in anger, but we've seen enough races and riders to pass comment... Funnily enough, you comes across as willing to bash Darcy, and certain Poole fans whenever you can. People in glass houses and all that!

Do you not think Steve is allowed to express his opinion? And also think he isn't allowed to express said views?

Highly disappointing display from the Pirates yesterday. It's been a reoccurring trend this year that we are getting slaughtered out of the start, and with the track being pretty slick most weeks, we're getting punished for it. It also seemed like the late afternoon downpour really caught the Poole riders off-guard, albeit no real excuse as all the riders were facing the same conditions. As the wet layer went, and the dust clouds returned, they started to get it together, but it was too late. KK continues to be a major let-down, especially considering some of his performances at Wimborne Road lasts season when he passed Chris Holder from behind several times. He really should be averaging 9+ with ease in this league. Difficulty is replacing him, especially as all the others are hard to drop, so it almost HAS to be a like-for-like swap, and who is there!!?? Shanes is the obvious candidate to go with him if we strengthen at the bottom instead, but that would be pretty ruthless IMO. Everyone knew at the start of the year it would be a tough learning curve for Shanes and I think it would be a short-sighted move to drop him. I'd rather play a role in developing a talented youngster like Shanes than bringing in a less No.1 and keeping Kerr personally.

Your interpretation of my post is misplaced. You are suggesting that I was implying Belle Vue were inferior, which is not true. Firstly I was talking about the Kings Lynn v Belle Vue match, and drew comparisons to their performance on a track that saw similar comments made about it (slick, dusty, poor spectacle for fans). Belle Vue were the better team at Wimborne Road on that particular night. It so happened that the track was as slick as I've personally seen it in a long time, and the Aces were much faster from the gate all meeting long, and punished the Pirates for it, albeit they lost due to Bjerre's engine failure when leading Heat 15. "Most tracks are very slick these days" - sure, and most curry's are "hot", but that doesn't make a Korma the same spiciness and a Phall does it? When the Aces came to visit, the track was especially slick, and Belle Vue handled the conditions much better than Poole did on the night. Funnily enough Poole don't lose often at home, hence the success of recent seasons, so while you may choose to see my words as an "excuse", it's me rationalising a below par performance from a team the perennially challenges for league titles.

Sounds like the second time this year Belle Vue have taken advantage of team seen as title-contenders on their travels by out-gating the home side on a very slick and dusty track. I'd suggest the lesson to be learned here is simple - Belle Vue are a side that can ride ultra-slick tracks very well. If you allow your home track to be prepped in such a way when the Aces visit, you're asking for trouble.

Was just throwing some names into the hat for discussion. This is a forum after all, and giving KK the boot seems the topic-du-jour right now!

If we're looking for non-Poles as a replacement for the disappointing KK, what about Michael Jepsen Jensen or Mikkel Michelsen? Tomas H Jonasson is still an asset... and of course Lindback, although I'm not sure Tonio is one to rely on after last year's debacle. I'd say the best options would be Vaculik, one of the Pawlicki's, or Dudek though. Well, Magic of course, but he doesn't fit. Not sure what Hampel and Sayfutdinov's averages are either...

Very disappointing performance from the Pirates. Firstly, the track was incredibly slick, and somewhat dusty, producing poor racing all night. Whilst I'm aware riders prefer the slicker and therefore 'safer' tracks these days, this was too far in that direction for my taste. There were multiple races when faster riders were unable to pass slower ones in front of them, despite trying multiple lines, and as far as a viewing spectacle goes, last night's product was terrible. Gate 1 provided the heat winner of 6 of the last 8 races I believe. As for the Poole team; KK continues to look slow. I'd say he was better than a week ago, but in all honesty it was hard to tell as it was gate-and-go last night, so even if he was on faster bikes you wouldn't have been able to tell, as you couldn't pass. Holder was underwhelming, but I'm willing to give him a pass for the time being. He needs to improve though. Kerr was trying, but failed to make an impact. The sooner Kyle is back, the better. Kurtz was my rider of the night. He challenged all meeting, and tried both inside and outside lines. He was one of the few riders that made a pass on the night, albeit on the first lap. He's riding the Chris Holder line and its working well. Hansii was solid. Not as good as last week, but probably because he wasn't sharp enough from the gate. Klindt did what was expected from a "super reserve". He scores double figures as long as he is at reserve, and despite his "gating tart" reputation, he was clearly making an effort (albeit futile) when chasing, hence his fall. Shanes rode better than he scored. He continues to look stylish (reminds me of Steve Schofield) and like Kurtz, he was willing to explore multiple lines when chasing. Again, this proved to be a fruitless task on the slick track, other than his last to second in heat two. His gating has been pretty good too, all things considered. Onwards and upwards I guess. Second year in a row when we've been caught out against Belle Vue by our own track prep. It's the same for everyone, but home riders have an expectation....

Poole to win by 16-18. Bet365 have it as Poole -12, SkyBet are Poole -10

People are clear Shov isn't the Poole Management right? And that he can express views on his desires for the sport that do not reflect Poole's best interests? Why does Poole's recent success with Aussies (and Poles) mean that Steve can't push a British riders first agenda? Everything is so black and white!

I'd suggest the reason Poole hammer so many teams when they travel to Wimborne Road is the fact we've had a team capable of winning the league most seasons for a good seven years, and top teams often easily dispatch weaker ones. Poole are also a ruthlessly run club - no quarter given - hence the numerous trophies! As Gavan implied, the track is fair with regards to its shape and size, however the criticism of its preparation is overblown by the Poole bashers to my mind. It's not perfect, and it can get dusty, especially for afternoon meetings, but more often than not it provides decent racing in my opinion.

This feels like the "Which came first; the chicken or the egg" - Poole have been league favs most seasons in recent years. Poole have also been in the league final in 6/7 of the last few seasons. Cause and effect? Or predicted outcome bearing fruit? As pointed out by Bwitcher earlier, it is often the case that the previous year's team has no bearing on the following year's teams chances of success. So with that in mind, I'd contend that the bookmakers (if worth their salt) will be pricing up their markets based on the current side for the current season. On that basis, logic suggests the 2017 Poole Pirates, favourites to win the league with all eight national bookmakers betting on speedway, are strongly fancied to be serious title contenders yet again.

Well since 2010, Poole have won the league four times, finished runners up twice, and lost in the semi-finals last year, so their perennial installation as the favourites has been shown to be a correct assessment of their chances. Your statement as to the new race format, and the potential to strengthen a side is true, but that doesn't change the fact that Poole are deemed by many to be the most likely winners again this year.

Excellent is a subjective term. Have you heard of something called the echo chamber? Might explain why you seem to like the comment so much. All I am saying is that the agreed-upon league favourites, being touted as the most-likely champions, is not getting "carried away". You, Gordon and anyone else for that matter are entitled to their opinions, and yes two 'challenge matches' in March doesn't make you champs. However, you continue to dodge the fact your own comments are hyperbolic and without substance when taken in their full context of suggesting Poole fans are getting "carried away". My understanding was that it was Shanes practising in the afternoon as he hadn't ridden the track before. I'm sure there are other posters in here who could confirm this, and whether any other Poole riders also were on track. *edited for accuracy* Starman has replied later in the thread as follows: "Yep as i said, KK James, Holder Hans and brady all had a spin, as no press and practice spin." So yes Steve, several Poole riders did get a sighter of the track earlier in the day. Didn't do much good for KK though, haha. As for how dusty the track was, I agree it was dustier than ideal. The recent weather, variable forecast and the poor condition of the track the previous Friday will have contributed to the decision to under-water. It does annoy me that the track staff seem to think whacking the hose on it for 30 secs between heats is good enough in such conditions.

Ok - so what are you deeming Poole fans getting "carried away" then, for clarity's sake? Because in my mind that would suggest they are expecting more success in the coming season than the prevailing masses. That is why I referenced the opinion of multiple national bookmakers, as an impartial arbitrator of the expectations for the team this season...

I'd contest that the "Shield" is a little more than any old challenge match, but whatever, we all have our own opinions. I'll concede that the teams are different so the relevance is marginal. You seem to have ignored that eight national bookmakers, a series of independent judges, all with a financial stake in being correct, who all agree Poole are the most likely league winners. Are you being willingly ignorant, or just plain argumentative?

Of the eight bookmakers offering prices on the Premiership, six make the Poole Pirates outright favourites, while the other two make them joint-favs (with Kings Lynn). This Poole side also just beat the defending league Champions 58-32, to win on aggregate 98-82. On that basis, suggesting that Poole will win the league is hardly getting "carried away". It's the prevailing opinion. Ah, fair enough - sorry Sid! Klindt did make a couple of "passes" I think, but it would have been fait accompli on the Wolves reserves, rather than a hard fought battle. Not exactly a difficult "pass".

*I misinterpreted Sid's post to be about Shanes, rather than Klindt* (sorry Sid) I'd have thought his credentials as the European Grasstrack Champion, and x2 British Masters Champion, show that James is capable of performing under pressure. Those are two of the highest profile events for British Grasstrack riders... You don't win those types of event against the calibre of opponent he did without some sort of challenge. In fact, when James won his European title he was having a shocking meeting and it was all going wrong, yet he knuckled down, made the final and got the job done and lifted the trophy.

Yeah, but KK will average over 11.00 at home. He is currently the best rider in the world at Wimborne Road, in my opinion. Back in 2012 when we had Ward, Holder and KK their home averages over the course of the season (as per speedway-stats.co.uk) were: Ward - 11.27 KK - 11.12 Holder - 10.60