25yearfan

As someone who's been going to Ipswich speedway since they enjoyed a fierce rivalry with my 1st love Norwich speedway I'm well aware of how good John Berry was! But I've heard many fans in the subsequent years since Berry's departure from Ipswich go on about how things would be better if John Berry was running Ipswich or indeed British speedway. But in all honesty the 1970's were very different times to what they are. If John Berry was about now I struggle to see where he'd do much better if any better at all. Speedways biggest problem now is how to attract younger supporters to watch cause its scary at many tracks to see older faces the largest % of the dwindling crowds. Take away the over 50's from crowds and you'd have hardly anyone attending. When the over 50's pass away who's going to replace them? As much as the Phillips father and son duo got it wrong at Birmingham they weren't helped by the poor crowd levels. Birmingham can be sustainable if ran properly and by persons with big finance! Like I said last night, the fans fighting fund should help to ease the costs of any new promotion and to enhance their apetite to do it!

Great figures for the fighting fund which surely gives any potential new owners extra motivation that taking over the struggling club is worth it? I'd imagine this £8000+ would cover at least 3 of the home meetings which the previous promotion haven't paid the GRA their rental fee? Going back to the previous argument about the 1970s Brummies team - Birmingham speedway were in a catch 22 situation at the end of the 1975 season. They reopened in 1971 and had been getting huge crowds. In 1974-75 they dominated the 2nd Division to such an extent that fans started getting bored so crowds dropped. Birmingham knew that to simulate interest and to get crowds going up again they had to move up but moving up also meant that the many Coventry, Cradley, Wolves and Leicester fans who used to pop along to the Ladbrokes to sample 2nd Division speedway lost interest in going to watch teams they were seeing at their own tracks. This combined with the extra costs involved in top flight speedway and the authorities making it as difficult as possible for the Brummies meant that for a number of years Birmingham speedway struggled. It got better when Dan McCormack took over and the team improved. Birmingham were ticking along nicely until the end of 1983 when they had the rug pulled from under them when the stadium was sold for redevelopment. Indeed I reckon that had the Ladbrokes stadium survived to this day then its likely Birmingham would have never closed down and would of been a top flight club all the way to present? Cradley speedway this year if they walk away with the NL title again will be in a similar situation where they have to move up to the PL next year in order to maintain interest but moving up would create problems such as increased costs and having to charge the fans more to watch them. This led to the club moving to the new but facility sparse, Wheels Project in Bordesley the other part of the City in an unfriendly area outside the traditional speedway heartland. The poor facilities, poor promotion with low funds who in the latter days were actively looking to move away from the Wheels track, poor co-operation from the Wheels owners, watching a poor 2nd Division team after having a decent decent 1st Division team with Hans Nielsen and co combined to attract lowish crowds. The present problems wouldn't be occurring if Tony Mole had taken over at the end of last year and while its proven that Birmingham speedway aren't going to attract crowd figures like near neighbours Coventry, Wolves and Cradley having capable persons in charge would make Birmingham speedway viable! Fingers crossed the Brummies survive!

Yes I'm, sure the continuity was a consideration but saying it had nothing to do with one of your riders (Ryan Fisher) racing for Friday nighters Coventry who are also ran by the same promotion with many persons involved at both clubs is gobbledygook! Peterborough speedway ran continuously on Friday nights from their formation in 1970 right up to 2000 with no problems including Friday nights when the Showground was awash with people involved in setting up a weekend show. Indeed I remember absolutely huge crowds in 1970-71 7-8000+ when the club ran meetings coinciding with big shows taking place there! If running on Friday nights was viable for 30 years then it should of been viable afterwards as well! Enough people have come on here saying Tuedays aren't viable for them while Fridays would be and the people who come on this forum would only be a small % of Peterboroughs crowds and potential Friday night fans! Lets use a similar example at ironically Mick Hortons other club Coventry a number of years ago. Now Coventry are one of the Countries best supported clubs but a whileback they moved to Thursday nights which resulted in a disasterous drop in crowd figures and Coventry soon moved back to Friday nights! Peterborough have always attracted a fair amount of their support from out of the County let alone the City and now on Tuesday nights this travelling support would no doubt have dwindled! Its been stated that Peterboroughs break even crowd figure is 700 - I think Friday night speedway would comfortably achieve this which would mean the club would making a profit! People will travel to Peterborough to watch because the track is fairly unique and normally produces good exciting, very fast speedway. Friday nights are much easier to do than Tuesdays!

Easy one! Firs Stadium Norwich where I first watched speedway in the 1950's! I wish the place had never shut down in 1964! I'm convinced had the Firs stadium survived to the present day, Norwich Stars would be in the Elite League and still would be one of the best supported clubs!

Friday night is Peterborough speedways traditional racenight and its a good one too cause many people don't have to get up for work the next day and the kids don't have school! This is the reason why Peterborough get poor crowds on a Tuesday! I thought one of the reasons for going to Tuesdays was cause Coventry run on a Friday night and at the time Ryan Fisher was doubling up with both! I understand why Chris Brown doesn't go a lot on the Hortons after what happened at Oxford but without Mick Horton there'd probably be no speedway at Peterborough so his negativity towards them on a Peterborough thread is a little bit wide of the mark! Oh and when I went to Peterborough speedway on Good Friday this year the crowd was very good at least 2000+ I'd say!

I've heard the old "lets get some of the local Poles going to speedway and the crowds will increase" Mullarkey before! In reality its a huge myth that all Poles are interested in speedway cause they aren't. Older fans like myself will remember that even in speedways glory years when crowds rivalled football there was still a sizeable % of folks who looked at speedway as a dirty nuisance! Most Poles over here are here for one thing and that's to earn and save enough money so they can send it back to Poland where they get more there money out there. Spending what to them is a small fortune at speedway is not on their agenda! Like Vince says while its understandable people will be dubious of the Phillips what alternative is there? I'm a firm believer in that when a speedway promotion starts a season they should finish it. I remember Newcastle disasterous elevation to the top flight in 1984 when they lost a packet and folded at the end of the season but the late great Ian Thomas finished the season! The Phillips run successful businesses so therefore I think should pay of there debts and then let someone else, Probably Tony Mole take over, which would be a good scenario! Hopefully we'll here some positive news tomorrow?

Firstly I'm not going to hang the struggling Brummies promotion cause afterall they put their money where their mouths are and most people aren't in a position to do the same thing! I'd urge them to just try and limp through to the end of the season then get out. That way they will be able to leave with their heads held high and would give the club a chance to survive into future seasons. Secondly on the SKY match against Swindon rained off after 9 heats a few weeks back - I had exactly the same thoughts about Swindons and mainly Alun Rossiters attitude that night. I thought, its been well documented that Birmingham speedway has been struggling and Rossiters actions that night cost the Brummies a lot of money. The track that night was wet but it didn't get dangerous. Tellingly the last race staged that night heat 9 was the 2nd fast track reserve race featuring supposedly the 4 least experienced, poorest riders on show yet they never had any problems getting around and the race as I recall was quite exciting and close. Now if heat 10 would of went straight out with 4 better more experienced riders then the race could of comfortably been run which would of given the meeting a end result which would of saved the Brummies much money! I said while watching this meeting that Alun Rossiter should see the bigger picture and try to get to heat 10. A few weeks before that a meeting at his home track Swindon was called of due to rain again but because his team weren't in a good position he wanted the meeting to carry on! I really, really hope the Brummies can keep going!

I've no doubt Leicester are still paying of the costs of setting the venue up. indeed they still need a permanent main stand that will have to be paid for! I have been told Leicester average over 2000 a meeting. If the seemingly very sensible and decent speedway promoter (despite what the Lions fans may say!) David Hemsley budgeted for crowds bigger than what they are getting then I'd be very surprised! Yes I'm aware of the rivalry between Derby County FC and Nottingham Forest FC and have seen this first hand at an England football match a few years ago when I saw Derby and Forest fans have an altercation. That said in my area Norwich City FC and Ipswich Town FC hate each other but I know more than a few Norwich City fans spectate at Foxhall, Ipswich and in the past I've even seen yellow and green Norwich shirts in the crowd at Foxhall! Going back to the days of the Firs, Norwich Stars speedway used to get a more than a few of their fans from Suffolk! Ipswich speedway is nearer for many people in Norfolk than what the actual Norfolk track King's Lynn is. Football fans tend to ignore their rivalries if they are interested in speedway. Myself for instance am a Norwich City fan but the speedway track I've watched most meetings at has been Ipswich, though had Norwich speedway kept going that would be different! This isn't taking into account the many speedway fans who couldn't give a monkeys about football! If both Nottingham and Derby had speedway teams then I'm sure they'd be a rivalry similar to the football like I remember Norwich and Ipswich speedways having but I'm sure any speedway enthusiasts from Derby would have no problem going to Nottingham to watch the great sport!

Yes its a long shot anyone would be interested in spending a fortune on introducing speedway to Nottingham Greyhound stadium! And that would be after a similar long shot of persuading the owners to let them do it! For the record I know for a fact Tony Mole enquired about staging speedway at Nottingham Greyhound stadium soon after Long Eaton finished in 1997 but the owners weren't interested! In these times of speedway struggling in our land, its amazing that anyone would want to risk their financial well being by putting 6 figure sums into speedway, so thank god for the likes of Tony Mole, Bob Dugard, Alan Phillips and quite a few others! Leicester are getting some of the biggest crowds in British speedway so they are doing better than what you make out! I still maintain that out of all the areas/Cities not currently staging speedway, the East Midlands area of which Nottingham is the principal City is an area that would have a better chance of supporting a top 2 tier speedway team then most others because it did at the sadly defunct Station Road Long Eaton even when the team were more often than not at the wrong end of the Leagues they competed in!

Most professional football teams play their midweek games on a Tuesday nowadays. It used to be Wednesdays in the past but they are few and far between! Anyway footy teams don't play home games every midweek anyway! I'm sure that if someone could persuade the owners of Nottingham greyhound to let speedway be staged there then the prospective speedway promoter's would be the ones paying for all the alterations required for the speedway! Like I said before, I think a well run speedway set up at Nottingham Greyhound stadium would work with Nottingham being a huge City, Derby no far away together with Long Eaton which got sustainable crowds!

I've been to the new Leicester speedway and was very impressed with everything including the track! While the paying customer has the right to criticise constructively I do find the Leicester fans moaning about the track to be over the top cause track isn't that bad and is certainly better than many others! I get the impression many Leicester fans are old timers from the Blackbird Road era who look at the past with rose tinted glasses on and are expecting a classic meeting everytime which isn't going to happen. I've learnt from watching speedway since the 1950's that one of speedways beauties is that if you get a poorish race (which every track does) then you know it will soon be over and the next race maybe better! Not every speedway meeting is going to be great and footballs the same! Your club is in a better position than my old team Norwich and what you were from 1984-2010 and indeed what Birmingham speedway currently are! A question for you unhappy with the track Lions fans - Your nearest other track is Coventry which doesn't always produce great racing, which track do you think produces the best racing? Personnally I'd say there would not be much to choose from both of them.

In fairness to speedway in London, Wimbledon speedway was on the up and making a profit when they had the rug pulled from underneath them in 2005 by the infamous (anti)greyhound racing association. Belle Vue while not the force they were when they were at Hyde Road, still attract viable crowds despite running on a bad night, and have never shut down with a new stadium potentially on the way, so while I wouldn't call the recent history of Belle Vue speedway a complete success, its certainly far from a failure. Ask the opinions of the many fans of defunct tracks (I'm one Norwich Stars) if they'd like the recent history of Belle Vue at their sadly departed track! Your right about the smaller sport of speedway getting lost in the bigger population areas. In theory London, Birmingham, Manchester, Bristol (although I think a new Bristol speedway track would probably be well supported), Glasgow, Liverpool, Nottingham, Cardiff and others should be able to support speedway teams better than rural places but in reality it doesn't work like that. A lot of the populations of the big Cities are ethnic, of whom nearly all have no interest in speedway and there is much more choice of leisure activities. The answer to Birminghams problems aren't clear though its obvious that a stronger promotional set up with better PR, commercial skills and speedway nous would help matters, though its wrong to be over critical of Alan Phillips cause not many of us would be able to put in the money to speedway that he has the last few years. With the number of tracks in the West Midlands connarbation and Leicester not far of either, the respective tracks need every aspect of the set up right, which I don't think has been the case at Perry Bar for a while. Birminghams competing against the long running set up at Wolves which is one of the most professional speedways in this Country while Coventry remains a hotbed with some of the biggest crowds anywhere. Add to this the new well run vibrant Leicester speedway where the novelty factor is still strong helped immensely by running on the more fan friendly Saturday night and the reemergance of Cradley speedway with their fanatical large support and its not difficult to see why Birmingham being less than 100% is struggling. In terms of the venue, Perry Bar was the home of Birmingham speedway during their glory years of the 1940's and 50's at the same venue while the mainly successful 1971-83 spell was at the old Ladbrokes stadium across the road where the one stop is now. Interesting to note that during the Brummies 40's, 50's era, Wolves and Cradley were shut down for much of that time and the Brummies themselves had folded by the late 50's. Did the Brummies in this time attract a decent % of their crowds from the then non speedway staging Cradley and Wolves areas, both of whom aren't very far away? During the 70's, 80's Ladbrokes era the Brummies were mighty strong in the early 70's when in the 2nd Division then after moving into the British League struggled for many years, only getting strong after signing Hans Nielsen from Wolves who themselves began a decline that ended up with Monmore Green not staging speedway in the 1982-83 seasons. When Birmingham went National League racing at the Wheels complex in 1985-86 the basic venue struggled for crowds in an rough area the other side of the City from the Perry Bar heartland. Had this venture been a success in a time when crowds were generally bigger than they are today then it wouldn't have shut. It must also be noted that during this Wheels era, the promotion were actively looking to move the team back to Perry Bar. It got to the stage at the end of 1986 where it was either move to Perry Bar or close completely. Unfortunately the then owner of Perry Bar didn't want speedway despite the Wheels promotion wanting to finance a move back and then soon after in the late 80's Tony Mole also tried to reopen Perry Bar but was also rebuffed. The present era of Birmingham speedway at Perry Bar from 2007- present would of likely been less successful at the Wheels complex going on the evidence of the 84 open license and 85-86 National League era at the same venue? Though I still maintain that the Wheels complex being in a central location would be ideal for a National speedway training centre with big and mini tracks and possibly 3rd Division and/or development League with amateur racing. The evidence I've gone through shows that while speedway racing is being staged at the same time at Birmingham, Wolves and Cradley (albeit at Wolves at the moment) then the weakest set up out of Wolves and Birmingham will likely struggle to keep going cause Cradley will always attract big crowds. Presently Wolves speedway is strong and well established so its probably not going to be them. Venue wise I think Perry Bars Birmingham speedways best hope of doing well. I think the other Greyhound track in Birmingham, 1930's speedway venue Hall Green could support speedway in a similar manner to Perry Bar but this was looked at during the 1987-2006 defunct spell and its close proximity to local housing would likely make this a no goer. Its been said by many West Midlands speedway fans, going back to the early 70's, that it was more interesting when the area had a team in the 2nd Division to go to, and why would you go to Birmingham to see teams you saw at Wolves, Cradley or Coventry? All this indicates that the present way forward for Birmingham speedway is too obviously try and finish this season, hopefully get new owners who can turn things around and drop into the Premier League where they could be joined by local rivals Cradley who've indicated they may have to leave the National League if they win it this season. Surely bumper crowds at Birmingham V Cradley matches in the cheaper Premier League would help ensure that speedway at Perry Bar would be viable? Fingers crossed Birmingham speedway can survive!

Has anybody involved in speedway been in touch with Mr Taggart? The last Wimbledon speedway promotion who I believe keep a close eye on developments or the BSPA? Surely Mr Taggarts bid would be strengthened by the inclusion of the resurrection of a famous team who represented the Borough?

Anyone with a big interest in Cradley speedway and British speedway as a whole would be aware that since failing to buy the Heathens former home Dudley Wood in the late 1990's, (not a criticism, Barratt homes were going to have the site whatever rival bid came in!) Tony Mole has been trying to find a site for a new stadium for the well supported club. Indeed I'm convinced that without the intervention of the very anti speedway local authorites in that neck of the woods, he'd of already achieved this and Cradley would be racing in the Elite League! The impression I got from last weeks announcement is that the Cradley management are hinting they have identified a site and Tony Mole is on board to finance it and to use his experience in reopening tracks! If anyone can do it then Tony Mole can!

Tony Mole looked into introducing speedway to Nottingham Greyhound stadium after Long Eaton finished after the 1997 season. Like greyhound says I think the owners aren't interested in speedway. I personally think the stadium would be ideal cause the facilities are decent, theres plenty of room inside the dog track for a decent sized speedway track and the Nottingham/Derby area is a big population area with Long Eaton slap bang in the middle, an area that sufficiently supported the Invaders at Station Road for many years. I'd say the chances of getting a site in Long Eaton would be minimal. People have said the facilities aren't supporter friendly for viewing but many dog tracks (and indeed other stadiums) before speedway tracks are built don't look suitable for speedway. If you went to Perry Bar before the Brummies returned there in 2007 it wouldn't of looked that suitable for speedway with the viewing areas but the stands installed on the 1st bend alleviated a lot of these problems. Perry Bar was looked at as a possible venue for Cradley after Dudley Wood was lost in 1995 but many said that the underground services in the middle would have rendered this a no goer for speedway! Kirky Lane Belle Vue in the 1980s was another one that until speedway actually went in and a few alterations were made, didn't look suitable for speedway! I well remember a speedway star interview with Workington and Glasgow legend Steve Lawson in the mid 1990's who stated he didn't think it was possible for speedway to return to Workingtons Derwent Park cause the stadium and rugby pitch had altered!! If speedway came to Nottingham Greyhound track then I don't think it would be right to use the Long Eaton Invaders name. Nottingham Outlaws was a name Long Eaton went under in the late 1970's and early 1980's and would be ideal for a Nottingham speedway team in the future. I think a properly run Nottingham speedway with a decent track built could sustain Premier League speedway at least, especially if they ran on Long Eatons former racenight of Wednesdays! Hopefully one day Nottingham Greyhound stadium will be owned by people who realise that the rental and bar/refreshment takings from one week of speedway would make the venue more profitable for them!

Why not build houses elsewhere? The chances of getting another site in the Coventry area are remote! Brandon stadiums a fantastic facility, why move anywhere else? Why would Sandhu sell Brandon for redevelopment in order to make a lot of money then build another stadium elsewhere that would cost at least £500,000 for a club of Coventrys stature and support? Sandhus made out that the sale of the stadium for redevelopment is set in stone and all permissions for this have been granted! All the issues Sandhu has come out with above are all smokescreens. He wants to sell the stadium and make a load of money with no thought whatsoever to speedway, stock cars, greyhounds and the history, heritage and asset to Coventry is whatsoever! What needs to be found out is what the current planning situation is because I bet that its not set in stone like Sandhu makes out. The stadium may even have a leisure use only restriction on it? Campaigns have to start NOW opposing Sandhus plans because if Brandon Stadium was lost the chances of Coventry getting going elsewhere quickly and at a stadium as good as Brandon would be remote. This is coming from myself an ex Norwich Stars fan - We lost the Firs Stadium in 1964!

I keep reading all this stuff about Ostergaards absence being the key but RR for him scored 9 which isn't many points away from what he'd of got. Take away the two tapes exclusions and the Witches might have won by more! I predicted a comfortable win for Ipswich tonight cause being an evening meeting the track would maintain moisture creating a grippy track with an outside line that would favour the home team. Good Fridays mauling by the Panthers was down to it being a daytime meeting which limited the quality of the track grip wise which played into the faster trapping Panthers side!

I've been saying this for a number of years now - take away the over 50's who make up a large % of crowds and speedway crowds would be even more pitiful than they currently are. When the current over 50's supporters slowly whittle away its hard to see where the crowds are going to come from. Vinces ideas seem very good! Although I like to see the Brits do well in it, personally I've got no interest in the media/commercial circus that is formula 1 racing. Its like standing beside any motorway watching vehicles pass by yet millions of people are interested in it. Speedway knocks spots of formula 1 as a racing spectacle, so all is not lost! It needs independent leadership with no self interest at the heart of big decisions and interest from major Companies and speedway can become more popular once again!

I know what riders I have put into the categories I stated but that would be unfair to name which riders go into each category cause I respect anyone that has a go but people watching Scunny could probably work it out! Like I said I respect Scunny for trying to be totally ethical about bringing on young Brits but the reality is half the Stags team are riders who wouldn't get in any other team apart from maybe the bottom end at Buxton and will struggle to get any better! If my local NL team, Mildenhall put out a team like Scunny Stags have they would lose over half their crowd and struggle to be viable. That's the perennial problem with Division 3 racing in this Country in that you will always have teams with different outlooks. Scunthorpe have taken their outlook to the extreme which in fairness Rob Godfrey said before the season started was exactly the idea behind the project! Yes King's Lynn have got a number of journeymen who'll go no further but like Mildenhall they have to try a put together a competitive team or otherwise they'd lose a packet running NL meetings at King's Lynn. I've been told Buster Chapman wasn't happy with the Stags line up being so weak! Another way to eleviate this problem would be to restructure the League set up in Britain with a bigger top flight featuring the stronger PL teams, a middle tier weaker than the present PL but with more Brits, EG the experienced old hands in the NL moving up along with the strong standalone clubs like Mildenhall, Kent, Cradley, Stoke and a more development based 3rd Division which would suit the Scunthorpe Stags ethic much better!

The ethics and theory behind the Scunthorpe Stags project this year are fair enough but in reality the team is made up of an old hand at no1 who isn't that experienced and is a 2nd string at best, 2-3 at the very most young inexperienced riders with potential and the rest journeyman, development League/amateur riders who no one else wanted with virtually no hope of ever getting better! I can see some standalone NL clubs reducing admission prices unless the Stags beef up their line up, just like Bob Dugard did in the late 70's at Eastbourne when ironically the visitors were Scunthorpe in the 1970's National League! As for King's Lynn, I'd agree the likes of messrs Mallett, Cockle, Hughes and Campos are journeyman National League guys who aren't going to get better but messrs Rose, Bailey and Owen will likely get better and like a previous poster says quality is better than quantity! I'd rather watch the likes of Cockle Mallett, Hughes and Campos than what I would no hopers trailing round at the back! Maybe if they were so interested in giving rides to inexperienced development riders Scunny would of been better of running two/three development teams in the Midland Development League calling them Scunny Stags, Saints and even maybe Hull Vikings?

I hope Stoke speedway sorts out its many problems and returns to being a decent sustainable set up! Its been proven in the past that when run properly Stoke speedway is a viable middle tier club. Running 3rd Division level racing there is always going to be difficult even when ran well because most of Stokes history has been spent in the middle with even one season in the top flight in 1996 when Cradley moved there so long term fans find that level hard to accept. Although Cradleys spell there in 1996 ended cause the crowds wern't that great and in my opinion in present times National League speedway is often better value for money! From what I've heard from many people in speedway and Stoke fans, the recent years have seen the standards drop big time and anyone constructively criticising the promotion (which the paying customer in particular those who've been going there for a lot of years have every right) have been met with abuse. The current problems epitomise this.

Somebody should get the petition online and on this site so we can all sign it to fight against this nonsense!

Excellent piece by someone who has certainly been a commited Glasgow speedway fan! Glasgow speedway has certainly had a colourful and chequered past! You should count yourself lucky that beings Glasgows such a big City, you've had other venues available after losing a previous track! I often wonder had White City near to Glasgow Rangers FC survived then would speedway in Glasgow be more popular? I loved going to Hampden Park, what a venue, particularly when speedway was there with its huge terraces. Unfortunately this venue was too big! The 1980's were mainly a very lean period spell for the club. The 2nd Blantyre venue would be a poor 3rd Division venue. Glasgow have done well to keep going. I'd love to see a National League team open up somewhere in Scotland to help produce some Scottish riders something of which we haven't seen much of lately! Any potential venues in Scotland for a National League team?

Telstar by the Tornados always reminds me of the last last few years at the Firs stadium, home of the great Norwich Stars!

Very true unfortunately! The same as anything thats loss making, how ever much you may enjoy it there will come a time when you think I don't want to keep burning money! Easy to critiscise when your not putting your own money in! The only hope now is some tycoon comes in last minute or one of the IOW few regulars win the lottery!