E I Addio

I think you are mixing up two separate things there. The thread is about the new race format and how teams can be built without knowing the race format. The matter of averages, guests etc, is outside the scope of the thread so lets put that on one side for a moment and come back it in a minute. The thing that people have been getting their knickers in a twist about, especially over the last few pages is the fact that the heat format has not been published and we have seen comments like "treating the fans with contempt" etc, but is it really that big a deal ? Lets consider two possible scenarios :- 1. Lets assume that the heat formula when published is absolute rubbish, the worst formula anyone could possibly devise. If that's the case its still going to be absolute rubbish when the season starts because they are not going to suddenly change it because some people on here don't like it. If they don't release it until the first meeting of the season all it means is that some people will have 3 months less to moan about it, but it will still be the same formula. 2. Lets now assume the heat formula is the most brilliant formula anyone could possibly devise. There will still be a few chronic complainers on here that find fault with it and , once again , if it is not released until the first meeting it simply means that some people have 3 months less to moan about it. Realistically the new formula will probably fall between scenario 1 and scenario 2, but the proof of the pudding is in the eating, in other words we won't really know how well it works until a couple of months into the season, but even then a good meeting will also depend on a multitude of other factors like track prep, delays and weather etc, so I really don't see what there is to get worked up about at this stage. Things like the imbalance between the quality of the reserves is a far more serious matter IMO. Turning now to your comments about r/r , calculation of averages etc , I take your point but in any walk of life new systems and new arrangements are very often subject to fine tuning but if we separate all that from the heat formula is it really something to get worked up about ? I am not sure the averages need much adjustment anyway as even on the old formula the second strings had two rides against reserves and its not beyond the realms of possibility that some of the more talented reserves on their home track will occasionally take points off a visiting second string. I honestly cant 'see why people are getting in a frazzle over it all. It will all be on us soon enough and we will see than whether it works or not. It would be of casual interest to know what the formula is but its hardly life and death as some are trying to have us believe.

So what's your problem ? We were told 3 months ago that the reserves would have two protected heats against each other and two against second strings yet we still have the chronic complainers on here worrying about mis-matched riders. All we don't know is the actual riding order of heats. For many seasons now we have seen heats with riders like Ales Dryml going against Darcy Ward or Some PL d/u rider in the same race as Freddie Lindgren but I can't remember anyone coming on here and complaining about the formula. We also saw the No1's going against each other at least twice, and usually three times. We still have 15 heats, the reserves still have four programmed rides, the heatleaders will still meet each other and meet the second strings. Once the race formula is released its hardly going to contain any earth shattering surprises. I think some people ought to get out more.

Can you identify the interview ? As far as I am aware he has made no public comments specifically stating whether reserves would have protected heats, although all the powers that be seem to imply that will be the case without actually saying so.

Then we'd have you complaining about a so-called "British " league that consisted of mostly foreign riders.

People bleat on about lack of investment in young riders but there is more going on than a lot of people realise:- http://www.kentkings.co/news.php?extend.106http://www.kentkings.co/news.php?extend.106 Interesting that the Hammers scratch team will include 3 graduates from the training school. This is the direction Speedway needs to go at grass-roots level.

OK, wait till the season starts and I'll put my mind to it. I think it will be a bit like writing to the Bournemouth Echo and suggesting that there is an outside possibility that Matt Ford is not the greatest thing since sliced bread,, and will get a similar response .i.e. straight in the bin, as others here have already said.

That was the last straw for me. I have supported the magazine for a long time for what it represents but after that fiasco I( cancelled my subscription. It didn't need to contain a controversial article but a piece putting both sides of the argument and an interview with some of the main people involved e.g Phil Morris , Danny King, Muddlo, and especially Tony Steele whom was ultimately responsible for the farce would be just the sort of thing to interest the fans but the chance was missed. Pleasing some of the people most of the time would be a good ambition to have. Quite honestly Philip, with people having less disposable income how to you plan to attract readers with stories that are to a large extent simply pulled off the internet and very little information of comment that fans can access anyway. After cancelling my subscription last September I did buy some individual copies because I did enjoy the article son Freddie Williams, PC, Chris Pusey etc because they contained information that was not generally in the public domain. Those sort of interviews or informed comment is what makes a magazine interesting not a load of turgid letters from "Disinterested of Tunbridge Wells " or "Ex-Fan of Chorlton-Cum -Hardy " prattling on about the selection of draft riders or some such moan that we can read on the internet anyway. The whole magazine has the feel that it is published by people who have no interest in attracting an increasing rather than decreasing readership. The fact that we even have a thread like this would set the alarm bells ringing on almost any other journal.

The letters page is the pits. It seems as if they sort out the most uninteresting letters or those that more or less repeat the same as last week. I can't remember the last time read a really thought provoking letter.

Dear me that's asking a lot after two years. Not at all sure but at guess I would say possibly Hunter Anderson who came over with his dad and bought Paul Hurry's bikes I think. Also spent some time working in PK 's pit, but this as I say is only as guess.

That figures, especially as they have trouble paying the riders on time, and when they do get paid they seem to be out of pocket riding for their national team. Why are we in this international competition if we have to run on a shoestring ? Like anything else in life, if a jobs worth doing its worth doing properly. If you can't afford it don't do it.

Sidney you are unbelievable. You read one word and your brain interprets it as something different. Where did I say Rosco was any body's fool ? I said he was not the sharpest tool in the box. That doesn't mean he is stupid it means (in my opinion) that there are better. As you never tire of telling us the forum is all about opinions but you don't seem to like it when someone has an opinion different to your own. Read the post. I said Rosco is enthusiastic and speaks the riders language so he is probably the right man to pull the side together at this stage of things. How is that patronising ? I also said I think Phil Morris is the best man for the job if we get to the stage of having a truly competitive side. So you don't like Phil Morris. Its still my opinion based on the way he is widely respected for his work with the youngsters, and the way he took a very average looking Brum team to the top of the league and still got them to perform well when they weren't getting paid, if you watch Phil at work in the pits he is on to the riders keeping them focussed and encouraged all the time, much more than any other manager I can think of. Rosco's problem IMO is he is too volatile when things start going wrong. Sorry you don't like honest opinions mate, but that's as I see it. If you disagree that's fine with me, but if you want everybody to agree with you there is no point in being on this kind of forum.

1. I am not on twitter and don't intend to be. Anyone who goes on there knows its a channel for abuse so it seems sensible to keep away. 2. I am not the Team GB manager so your second point is irrelevant. but whoever takes the job has to be able to deal with criticism with a bit of dignity, otherwise they just bring themselves and the sport into disrepute. Muddlo would have a lot more respect if he could just rise above that kind of personal abuse., and bring a bit of dignity to the job. 3. I don't have a personal grievance against him but I do think he is a well over-rated TM. Because the Lakeside pits are open to the public before and after the meetings you get to see a bit more of what goes on than a lot of places. My personal view is that in recent years Poole have had two great captains in Dave Watt and Chris Holder and in my opinion it has been those two , especially Holder that has stamped his authority and personality on the Poole team. If you watch people like Peter Adams or Phil Morris at work there is no doubt about who is in charge, and it aint any of the riders. But anyway the point of this particular thread is who is suitable to be Team GB manager. Muddlo hardy showered himself in glory. I don't think Roscoe is the sharpest tool in the box but he is enthusiastic and he does speak the riders language, so at this stage of things he is probably the right man to pull the side together and give the riders some passion but if we ever get to the stage of having a truly competitive team then I do think Phil Morris is the one for the job,

So what do you think the problem would be ? Chapman wouldn't allow them to use the track ? That is the only conceivable problem and even that seems unlikely. Could it be Muddlo just didn't think of anything like that ? One thing we have learned about Muddlo following hi public comments about Darcy's indicretions, and especially since he has been on twitter is that he can't handle any sort of criticism or complaint, talks a good fight but is very slapdash in his approach to many things. When the TM lacks leadership qualities he is not going to get the best out of his riders, hence the poor performance against USA and Latvia.

Motor crossing ? Was he on a car ferry or something ?

That is true and to some extent it is also going to be a bit of an unbalanced playing field with some teams better placed to do some things than others, some better placed than others to sign certain riders, and some in a better position to attract larger crowds than others. For example nobody could have worked harder or put more money in to Peterborough than Rick Frost but it seems clear that whatever anyone does top league racing is just not going to be sustainable in that area. That's no reflection on the club or its fans. Its tragic that all the effort Gary Patchet put into Swindon only resulted in him losing a lot of money rather than getting big crowds back and getting near a break-even figure. Time for fans to stop some of the "my clubs better than your club" comments and recognise that all clubs need each other, all clubs want to win and whenever you have winners there will always be losers, but the bottom line is its all one sport and without losers there wouldn't be any winners.

or this http://www.lakesidehammers.co/content/?p=6611 Can't remember any of the Blue Rinse Brigade coming on here and praising Jon Cook, Martin Hagon, or George Barclay for there efforts to get youngsters into the sport at a young age. It seems these initiatives are only consider worthwhile by the Blue Rinsers when Mat Sun-shines-out-of-his-bum is involved. I agree but that's doesn't seem to be the way Shovlar & Co see things.

Maybe others are trying to do something like this http://www.lakesidehammers.co/content/?p=6787

Obviously they can't both be correct but it matters not as its only a challenge anyway. One Poole poster will be carrying on about Pooles fantastic performance as if its the P/O final whatever the result but the rest of us know what challenge matches are about. Wouldn't surprise me to see Holder drafted in to cover for any absentees (if there are any), but with no league points at stake the result is immaterial.

The Lakeside meeting may not be the return leg according to the Lakeside website. Some doubts about certain Poole riders availability beleive Mafia +" A criminal organisation that operates under its own code of conduct without regard for normal laws. The Mafia is noted for its involvement in bribery, theft corruption, and racketeering" Yep, that sounds like Fat Maud to me !.

Unfortunately Torun is not in England so that is not a fair comparison, but a good meeting is a good meeting whatever track it is on. You can't make a sweeping statement that one is better than another. Last August in Heat 15 of the Lakeside -Poole meeting Lakeside needed a 3-3 to take all three points, Ward and Hancock made the gate then Hancock was passed first by Peter Karlsson the inside then by Piotr Swiderski on the outside. Great end to the meeting. I think you could safely say you wouldn't see that happen if Greg made the gate at Torun! There are many, many factors that go to make a good meeting and it is nonsense to make sweeping generalisations. They all have exciting and boring meetings. Amazing how the amateur track curators think that dirt is the answer to everything. If you put dirt down nothing will happen until you put some water with it. Getting the right amount in the right weather conditions is not an exact science and takes a lot of experience which even then can be messed up by a change in wind direction or the sun unexpectedly coming out just before the start. The "experts" than turn up and moan that the trackman is useless because there is not enough dirt, but in fact the amount of dirt tends to be pretty much the same week to week, it is the weather that changes Oh dear, sounds like Gavan touched a raw nerve

Good points. It reminds me of an old saying in road racing that applies equally in speedway, which is that good riders are fast riders who have discovered that the ground is hard and slow down a bit. To my mind Tai , in 2012 managed to tread the very fine line between going fast enough without over-cooking it. Darcy hasn't yet fully got used to the idea that the throttle works both ways although nobody would deny he is one of the most gifted riders ever to sit on a speedway bike, but at the very top level it does seem he needs to refine his undoubted talent a little Interestingly (and as far as I can work out) Tai is one of only 7 riders to have won the WC at his age or younger. Of those seven only Peter Collins and Michael Lee failed to go on to at least one other title. Collins was never quite the same after his bad leg injury the year following his title win and we all know how Lee threw his career away. Statistically there is no reason why both Tai and Darcy shouldn't collect multiple titles if they stay reasonably fit. Incidentally, Tai reminds me of Peter Karlsson in many ways. People talk bout Tai being a good gater but I seem to have seen him in a number of GP's where he has missed the gate then hung back , looked for the gaps, picked his line, found the grip and gone from last to first or second coming off the second bend. That is exactly what PK does and I think it takes a particular talent that not everybody has. At first I thought Tai was just lucky but it seems to happen too often to be just luck May be its coincidence but maybe Tai has learned something from the master.craftsman

We had a very informative forum lasting well over two hours chaired by Jon Cook a week after the AGM in which the fans had the opportunity to raise with the management team any matters they wanted about the team, the training school, the rules or the sport in general and a wide range of questions were answered very candidly, but like a lot of fans forums what is said at the forum stays at the forum. Jon also said that any fans could speak to him on race nights before 7-30 pm , so we have had it from the horses mouth, The team has been named, questions have been answered, so not much point in coming on here speculating about what may or may not happen in the future. I am a bit surprised that Fat Maud hasn't been so open with the Poole fans, then we wouldn't have had pages and pages of waffle on the Poole thread from those who think they know but actually don't.

This post which you put alike to sounds very much like a comparison and opinion that Darcy is the better :-Tai is a better gater but Darcy is a better racer overall and that will win through. So does this:-Just because Tai won the WC doesn't mean he is better. Blue-rinse tints.

That is exactly the point being made. One of the things that attracts most of us to the sport is the immense determination and courage of the riders. Non-Poole fans recognise Holders achievement without it being emphasised by the Blue-tints. It is the same with the Ward -v-Woffinden debate that certain elements within the Blue-rinse brigade are trying to promote. .They are very different types of rider.. Tai is more of a thinker while Darcy is a more instinctive rider.. They are both very good. Nobody wins a Speedway World Championship without a slice of luck. It was Tai's year this year but if he loses it next year or the year after that doesn't make him any less of a rider.. Equally Darcy will only win if he gets a year when the cookie crumbles his way , but if luck goes against him that doesn't make him any less of a rider. It comes down to engines and tuners as much as skill on the bike. Tai has jumped through all the hoops this year but Darcy didn't. . You can't really analyse it any deeper than that. Tai deserved it this year, but if Darcy wins in the future nobody will say he is not top notch. Its just that the Blue-rinse brigade have to make an issue out of it all the time.

Just imagine if he had won the World Championship with a twice broken shoulder, still unhealed and held together with screws and steel plates. We would never have heard the last of it from Dorset.