orion

As pointed out just many pl teams are not very stable and not paying the bills ..not sure why you keep forgetting about this .

You give us the same about the pl ? about revenue and crowds going up

Depends I dislike Horton like many but as least he saved the club this year ..being liked and saving or making money are two different things .

So are you saying that the PL is moving forward ? in what way ?

That's right when had a better standard we had bigger crowds and broke even and better

Adams never earned shirt buttons did he and when rode near the end the sport was still in a bad way ? tell me has Swindon Speedway been in a better state with or without him ? Ask Matt Ford if he feels he can justify keeping Darcy Ward or Holder and he will tell you yes due to the extra crowds they can bring in . You don't balance the books by just cutting the top earners out as some will pay for themselves .

Yet again it depends who is running the club no offence to Frost and Mahoney but I thought they done a poor job at Boro and that go's back to my point about Phillips and busting Brum at any level . You can't go league or league on losses without factoring in who is running the club

When Zagar rode for Swindon fans from Reading some that post on here would go just to watch him ride . Also when him and Leigh Adams were riding the crowds were decent and we were doing ok the moment they left and replaced them with Scot Nicholls ect Swindon have lost money season after season . Not sure who told you about the Boro crowds but reading the boro topics and the Mick Hortons statements the crowds have been shocking . Not sure why thou as you say the racing is great and that is what all people care about so we have been told .

I Don't agree with the post about Zagar ...if dies hard turn up every week no matter who was riding then the crowds each match would be about the same the fact is When Swindon ride Poole and Wolves the crowds are bigger due to Ward and Woffy . Also as I pointed out to yesterday Leigh Adams used to put 300 or fans on the gate so to say that star riders don't have effect on crowds is untrue .

Not spot thou is it .. as first of all Crowds have been falling long before you could watch tv matches . And me like many others only started going back to speedway when it came back on tv . Yet again most sports due to sky are now shown live on tv and many like Darts have bigger crowds than they did . To say any sport because you can watch it on tv will somehow make them not go out watch the sport on another night is not been proved in any way . Of course like most sports a live broadcast will have a effect on the crowd of that event .

No doubt Crook and Fraud will meet afterwards to make up the rules to suit there sides for next year .

Always the British match for me no matter what league. Just can get into the Poland and Swedish matches as I don't know the teams .

Sorry but were crowds going up between 1980 and 1996 before the tv matches ?

As I said there is less chance of survival without the top boys due to the loss in crowds so it's important that they stay . Yet again the mind set of a lesser grade of rider is somehow going to save speedway and save money is wrong

How would they balance the books ?

Fast track riders are not allowed in heat 15

The sky deal is six years and we are only one year into it .......nothing radical about putting out a weaker product so less fans turn up . That has been going on for the last 20 years hence why we are the state we are now .

Any club has to cut it cloth to amount of money it get's in and pays out it matter's not if they are in the El or Pl . There are clubs in both leagues who make money are there club who lose money as I have already pointed out . I am sure Premier League football clubs would not able to make the kind of signings they do now without the tv /sky money so if that went then just like speedway clubs they would have to budget for that

Has the plight of Boro Bimingham when they were pl Newport, Glasgow told you anything ? does that mean we have to change the pl ? .. for every club you can find who have had it hard at El level are find you a Pl club who have found it hard ... Ward and Woofy pay for themselves by the extra people they bring to the match . Do you know when Swindon started to find things hard ? The day Leigh Adams left the club, sure Adams got paid well ( when they paid him of course ) but he put 200 -300 on the gate every week so he paid for himself . This train of thought that if we dropped the best riders is somehow going to save the sport by giving us lower crowds is pie in the sky .

Poole are having no problems in paying Ward as Wolves have little problem paying Woffy on the other hand can Boro afford to pay the likes of Lewis Blackbird etc ? . As I keep saying plenty of clubs who don't have any top stars who can't make ends meat .Do Glasgow stuggle because they have top stars ?

Getting rid of the best people and crowd pullers makes no sense at all nor do ideas that will mean even less fans ... As I said before the Ward's and Woofies of this world paid for themselves ...a Savy boss would not just at what he pays he would look at what he was getting for his money before he starts to fire people . As I said before there are just as many teams in the Pl who don't have big names who find it hard to survive . Boro have been in the El with the sky money and cry about losing money and they have been in the Pl with the lower costs and cry about losing money

Not really as riders maybe get paid to ride badly from certain parties hence the agent tags ..they may even bet on themselves to score badly etc etc .

Has he ever won one ?

He's riding for Belle Vue v Cov so that rules out Harris and Hans as well Woffy won't do it and Doyle can't because of his Work Permit .

Who would you have you gone for ?