g13webb

Not really.........The main problem that exist with the draft scheme is that the some of the riders are way too strong compared with others in tier 2. , and will have far bigger influence on match proceedings. If like Rory said we used young talent and rode them at a permanent 7 , They would struggle at first but soon develop their skills as they would race against better riders, and eventually progress into the team. proper.... Because they would be riding against other heat leaders and 2nd strings, their differing skill level wouldn't be so directive to match results.... and therefore, more importance would be put on teams winning the big heats.....

I'm sure if that became the norm, there would be at least 8 youngsters out there only too willing to try.......

He words were direct when he described as a load of B-------ks.. He said all other countries had their own schemes in place to assist the development of home riders. The draft was only implemented to save the promoters money, not to develop new talent..... He suggested each team to have 3 home riders, 2 in the main body of 1-6 and a third to be under 21 and placed at No7. The protected heats does nobody any favours. If they wanted to ride against others similar to themselves then they can do that in the PL. He went on to say, when he started, he had to race against, Gollob, Rickardsson, Crump, Loram every race. You'll never get better riding against people of the same, you have to race against the best to improve...... As with the rest of his comments: Very forthwith and direct to the point.... Nice to listen to someone who tells it like it is..........

Interesting hearing Rory's comments, especially about of the Draft scheme.. .......

I have this feeling that because of all the on-going shenanigans, fans are that fed up, they couldn't give a damn who signs for who anymore.....

Having seen the announcement that the 'Heat Leader list' is only in force at the start of the season. After the first set of averages come out, Teams can have as many heatleaders they want. Probably Bjerre wouldn't be a bad option..... Crazy rules, ........ Like Camelot, the BSPA are turning this sport into a Lottery.....

I for one wouldn't be annoyed or surprised. There's no getting away from the fact he been troubled of late, but he's still a far better rider than his scores suggest..... On his day, he is still capable of beating anyone in the league.......

As like so many others, you have gloss over facts, purely to verify your perception of my opinion. When the draft was first introduced I was one of the biggest objectors, understanding the issues that would transform from riding in protected heats. When the list of draft riders were first released , they were positioned by their PL average because most had not ridden in the EL. In that list of riders, Kerr was placed at the top and Rose was positioned at the bottom... So yes in that first year, we utilised the option (Like other teams) of protecting Lewis Kerr, and also collared Rose who was the lowest. I can see why people are voicing their concerned , in that he was picked out first, but had the draw be done correctly, chances are, we would still have got our man. Thinking back, although the promoters agreed at the time, it was only when Rose started to perform did the sceptics start . Yes I have always pursued the point that teams should find the own riders and spend time and money to progress their talent. and thought it was wrong when teams like Swindon in 2015 took away a talented youngster in the view of fairness. Regardless of his low average, I am pleased he is back at Lynn in 2016. My comment about being fair is related to the on-going deception of the positioning of riders and the availability of others. Why the BSPA persistently use PL averages to determine position of riders, riding in the EL is a complete joke. We all know that Newman is the standout Draft rider in the league, but relentlessly he is placed so Poole get preferential treatment. The whole draft idea is floored because of the false positioning of riders. The idea of the draft who introduced to help the team that finish bottom and should benefit more than those who finished top. But not in our sport...... So Yes, if we are running a draft, let the teams at the bottom of the league have first pick of both their Tier 1 and Tier2 riders, and the team finishing top have last choice. That's the 'DRAFT' way, If that cant be implemented, then let all teams secure their own riders with acceptable averages.. Either way I'm not bothered. I'm sorry if my views don't agree with yours (by the way all your 'Likes' were so predictable ) but to me there is only one way to do things. While we have deceptions like Lakeside signing Kerr after the selection process is finished, the process will always be laughable......

WELCOME BACK

Come now. .. The draft system is a lot of things but fair it is not. It has been a farce from day one. Instead of doing it for the good of the sport , it was concocted to benefit certain promotions. Why should riders be governed to where they have to ride? Why should clubs, who doesn't have a youth policy, benefit over those who have? And why do we have to keep referring back to PL averages to determine the selection procedure. Its a complete farce from the start to finish....... With a little bit of thought, the introduction of new British riders into the Elite league, could have been really good and benefited the sport. Each Club should have been enforced to sign their own British rider with the purpose of riding at reserves. Their averages would be counted into the team strength, so if a team fielded strong reserves their team 1-5 would have to be lesser quality to accommodate them. There would be no need for Lists, False averages, Bias selections processes, Draft orders or issues of unfairness. Riders would be able to ride where they wanted, and Managers would be responsible for the strength of their own team. It could have been so simple....... Talk about making things complicated.......... I agree, allowing Barker to ride as a draft would be farcical, .... but no more so than some teams having two picks of drafts before others have had one..............especially when using false averages to achieve it.

How would Poole have been able to get Ellis as their second pick if there wasn't 8 Tier 1 riders in front of him?. Therefore Blackbird had to be included in the top eight. The fact he had retired was irrelevant ..... Come on' keep up please......... you ought to know the rules by now

When the Rory night was arranged I thought this coud be the night when annoucements were made. Now I'm not so sure........ Personally , I not bothered who they get to ride. Such is the sate of the game now, the winning and achieving something doesn't seem so important any more. I shall continue supporting hoping to enjoy the basis of what the sport was once all about ....... and forget all about those stupid lists, those complicated rules , and the merry-go-round of riding positions with fictitious averages....... 38 - 40 was a wonderful time. Why has a sport that is, so basically straight forward, been made so complex.

Wonderful and fitting finale to a truly great servant of our sport. Little boy blue touched many people with his genuine and friendly approach to life. He led by example and helped everyone who asked...........What a pity there isn't more like him... Lovely to see some of the former greats gathered to pay their respect..... Brilliant..........

Yeah....... I still enjoy the racing. Its inbreeded into me. What you say about the TV is more true than people realised. I adored Mike Hailwood but was only privileged to see him a few times a year, whereas with Rossi I watch every MotoGP™. Thinking back, I can relate to most of the times I watched Hailwood remembering most of the details of his races, where now my collection of Rossi races is quite immense, his race detail fade with time . Its the same with most sports and in that way TV has a lot to answer for. Of cause it's better we have this facility, but them olde days will always live on....

It's nice to look back thinking of all the good ole days, but the sport today is a million miles apart from what it use to be and as such is difficult to compare. Brought up by my 'Bike Mad' dad I knew nothing else than attending meetings, Scrambles every week, Speedway every other week at Norwich and any opportunity, we fitted in Road Racing and Grass Track as well. It was one of those midweek grass track meeting at Peterborough, when the Showground was in the town ( Dogthorpe I believe) that I remember Barry Briggs for the first time. Standing 10 foot tall he was surrounded by fans 20 deep, so much so, it caused an obstruction that he had to be fenced off to give him space Whose that Dad?, I asked. he son, is the greatest rider you'll ever see. Sure enough that night he was superb. he won all his races at a canter, an embarrassment to all other riders he readily lapped. He was from another planet. Shortly after we were at the Firs .the confrontation between him and Fundin were eagerly awaited. My dad had a big wager on Briggs . but it was never in doubt, out in front or from the back Briggs ruled Fundin that night. From then on I followed Briggs career. I thought he was far better than his trophy count. and on his day he was truly majestic. My Dad's assessment of him wasn't wrong....... Looking back at those times brings back wonderful feelings and I think that is were the differences lie. I know the bikes are faster, the riders more professional, but to me it was the occasion of the event that made them stand out. The environment totally took over the event. I went to loads of Wembley finals . It wasn't that the races was terrific, but the crowd, the noise and exciting was the governing factors that made it memorable. I don't think those times will ever return. The world now is a different place to the one we were brought up in. I for one will be forever grateful that my dad was that Motorbike Nut.

I'm sure the BSPA have looked into this possibility.....

The shape alone doesn't guarantee good racing. I have been to most of those tracks (except Plymouth) and have seen ordinary racing as well. I have visited Peterborough many times, and have seen some wonderful meetings, but I've seen some crap ones as well. equally as bad as those at Lynn. Regardless of peoples opinions on what shape and size of track they prefer, the most important aspect to good racing is the way the tracks are prepared and the material used to perfect them..... It is of my opinion, that if time, effort and money was put into the preparation, then most tracks will produce quality racing.......

Both mine were deliviered as normal, by the local Newsagent, always there before 7am in the morning. Today; Was a good read, especially the interview with Torben Olsen and the England and the USA series from 1980. It's refreshing to read how good the sport once was and how everything was based around the UK tracks. We ruled the world then...... I was fortunate to be at Wimbledon for that first meeting, and can remember it well. The racing there wasn't ever that special, but the venue, the atmosphere, the tension, all made it such a momentous occasion, that will be remembered for years to come. At the end of the day a draw was a fitting finale to a fantastic meeting..... Such a shame when big venues like Plough Lane, close down. Very difficult to replace those institutions .......

Probably a circular track would be to you liking ??

I don't think there's a lot wrong with it. Some meetings are bland and follow the leader rubbish, where others can be really top draw. A lot depends on the riders attitude and the will to fight. Niels usually finds a way by when it is needed...... Not being a trackman, I'd be the last to say what should be done, but obviously the shape and size appears to be OK. To me the problems relates to the weather, the material used, and how much topping is on the track. These are all variables and can alter from week to week...... Like I say, who am I to say what's the answer is.

You too are missing the most important aspect of the CMA. If these figures don't relate to the riders ability, then they don't serve any purpose. You may as well pick numbers out of a hat for how accurate the CMA's are.... In one breath the BSPA are saying the figures are wrong and invent a list to overcome the problem., then continue using them same inaccurate points to access team strength. Yes you could increase the points as you say, but that doesn't alter the distorted figures the rider's have at the moment. I haven't the lists of rider's averages with me at present, but I think I'm right in saying, Newman has a better EL CMA than Holder, but as riders, they are leagues apart. same with riders like Garrity and Kerr and anyone else riding in protected heats, these will all have these fictitious scores. Try and explain that to someone new to the sport. 'This chap Holder is a bit special, was world champion 3 yrs back and is one of the best riders in the world.' and the reply comes; 'Oh how do you explain him being that good when a reserve rider has a better average then him.' And we wonder why the sport has lost all creditability......

Thank you for your post. At times I felt 'Am I the only one who can see the problems being created' ?? but at last someone agrees with my views exactly. The said heatleader list hasn't solved any problems, all it has done is papered over the big issue of distorted CMA's. But this problem won't go away. Each year that passes the situation will get more ridiculous. Sometime, somehow this problem will have to be addressed. The longer it is left the gap between reality and factual will get more distorted.. One more thing, in answer to your final query: the reason the BSPA use the PL averages for sorting out the draft riders is because their EL average are higher then the heatleaders. That fact alone highlights the massive problem..........

No quite, It was reported from the AGM that when the Job share was discussed, one promoter, rejected it, saying as he was in contract talks with a top rider , he didn't want a job share to interfere with the negotiations. and the subject was than shelved. so in other words because one Promoter said 'No' everyone else agreed with him. Now that's a ridiculous situation, when the progress of our sport can be dictated by a single promoter...

I have never seen the reason why the question was asked, their will always be a difference of choices, when opinions are sought. To me it was never an issue of which team benefitted from the list , more of a point of why a list was deemed necessary. The only positive I take from the list is that the BSPA recognise that the CMA alone, gives an unrealistic indication of riders ability and therefore authorised an additional list just to add some sensible balance to team building.

Gordon Pairman: I too would like to thank you for your time and the explanations as you have explained. I found them all most enlighten. As an outspoken poster against the said list, my problem wasn't related to how the list was created, more to the reasons of why it was required. I get the concept of needing additional clarification when building team equality, of which the list offers some form of help, but once the season has started the list is of no help at all. Since the introduction of the draft riders and the protected heats. The validity of CMA has disappeared. The reserves riders score points far easier than 2nd strings or heat leaders and as such, the points limits bear little to the reality of the strength that the points indicate... So rather than a simple list to assist the team builders, surely it would have been better to target the problem of the variable averages. If the CMA doesn't relate to the riders ability, what's the points of using them ??????