g13webb

This whole scenario has an air of unrealisium about it and the events are not really happening..... Surely a iconic Speedway Club of 50 yrs standing, is not going to be destroyed by some petty pinching individual who wants his penneth of corn. Surely the club is worth more than this........

The news every speedway fan wanted to hear. Belle Vue comfirmed as definitely racing this year https://twitter.com/SpeedwayGB

While there's a chance, there is hope..........When there s no hope, we have nothing....

I think Somerset wiIl do far better than people imagine and will be more than competitive.... . The advantage of using riders with a PL CMA it is a far more accurate assessment of the rider when racing against those of similar ability . By using the rolling average over 20 meeting give a far more truer indication of their talent under similar conditions.. ( No protected heats) So come next year they will be racing against those same riders plus a FEW better ones thrown in. On that basis they should be able to score points similar to those from last year. Of course there will be some that struggle, also there will be some who really improve along the way. Most teams have a I or 2 big hitters who will have to be beaten but nothing that they haven't raced against before. No doubt the teams points scoring will come down also but not as one sided as most appear to think.... When we talk about riders will EL CMA it has been decided to load them with a (x1.4) factor to equate their point scoring ability to the Pl rider from the start. This is where there are many variables. Because of last years protected heat format the EL rider's acquire CMA was fabricated at best. 2nd string riders with higher averages then HL from easier races. this is what we have to move away from. When looking at top riders like Dolye, Holder and Lindgren , they are more than capable of increases their points haul to offset the loading with which they started. But lesser riders with no PL average will have a far bigger job over coming the loading placed on them. So in this instance, just because they were rationalised as EL riders, their ability to score points could be harder than those of PL standing. Poster are picking up the wrong end of the stick. I have not run the BSPA down and have praised them for what they are trying to do.. A few posters say I'm talking rubbish but have yet to say what I have said that is wrong. I still believe there will be many variables when the new figures are released, Who has raced against the harder teams, those who raced in bad weather, Those who raced on bad tracks, Teams that have suffered bad injuries all these are issue that effect match results, Also in the equation is the make-up of the teams. Some riders will settle in quicker then others, some will be slow starters. Nothing will be settled with the first set of figures, all it will do is set a new standard that all are judged. It will not be till months down the line will we get a true indication of what team make up is better..... As for making a prediction I'll leave that until I seen all the teams.....

Please tell Which part is wrong ???

Your reply has given me a good laugh, and the two poster who liked it was so predictable. For your information, I acquired and 'O' level at 15, 'A' level at 17, degree at 20, followed by ONC in Mechanical Engineering at 24.. For the last 40 years I was a Project Engineer where compounded calculations were the order of the day. I have supplied many structural Calculations for building, so please spare me the insults talking about the impact of the Multiplier.... Now if anybody has got this wrong then you should first look at yourself. Lets start first with the old CMA figures of the Elite League. Because they were so varied and untrue, it was decided to use the rider's PL average, where possible, as this figure was thought to be a truer reflection of one's ability. ( Fair Comment) Coupled with this decision it was to create a loading that to bring the EL riders, who had no Pl average, into a comparison with the ability of those PL riders. Also taking into account the racing format was changing to make the HL role easier. Taking all these things into the equation, it was decided a loading of 1.4 to multiply the existing EL average to form a comparison with the PL averages.... but only until the first set of new figures become available. ( Not all the rider get this multiplier, only the ones who didn't have a PL CMA) ........ Do hope you're keeping up. 1. When a team Manager assembles his team he had 50 pts to play with. If he use 7 riders with PL averages. then he would add their said PL scores with no multiplier to be seen... When the first new set of figures are acquired after 4H and 4A it is expected some riders will score less and the teams points will drop. .. but not that much.... ( a multiplier hasn't been used or changed) 2. When a team Manager assembles his team he had 50 pts to play with. If he use 7 riders with EL averages. then he would add their said EL scores and Multiply by 1.4 ( 35.71 EL pts x 1.40 = 49.99) When the first new set of figures are acquired after 4H and 4A the team score will diminish. They will automatically lose 14.28 from the loading they started with but it is expected their CMA will go up to compensate for it..... ( a multiplier was used and now dropped) 3. When a team Manager assembles his team he had 50 pts to play with. If he use 5 riders with PL averages. and 2 EL riders, then he would add their said PL scores plus the EL scores multiplied with 1.4 . ( (PL pts x 5) +( EL x 2 x 1.4)) .. When the first new set of figures are acquired after 4H and 4A the team score should diminish. They will automatically lose the loading of the 2 EL riders, but all the riders will count as scored ..... ( a multiplier was used and now dropped) So you see, the make-up of the team has massive implications. Not all EL riders will increase the score by (*1.4). Not all PL rider will drop their scores. No doubt as time goes, it will all rectify itself when all riders will used the correct averages for the league they compete it We are in a change-over stage where some will win and some will lose, It is the intention to get back to a more realistic situation than it's been for some years.... So you see I am well aware of the implications of the multiplier, and I hope I have shown you how it makes a massive difference by the way the team has been assembled....

That's the point, we don't a team with 7, 2nd tier riders. If there were it would be more feasible.... Most teams are only using 2/3 riders with their EL loaded score...the rest are on PL averages that was attained in the PL.

I don't get your calculations. when most teams have only a couple of EL riders the 'old money value' is way higher than your 36. You're getting mixed up with teams having 7 EL riders with loaded averages. we haven't had that for yonks!!!

I appreciate that, that is why the 50 pts max to assemble a team to me was miles too high.... It was my believe all the riders CMA were too high, Using false figures from another league was the only option once the protected heats gave out them false averages... .

I'd go along with them KL predictions, but that come to a few more than 42 you mentioned.... Puzzled?? My thinking was the PL rider has an average gained against mostly PL riders, who they race every week in the PL league. so bearing in mind there are not many EL only riders per team, it would be imagined their score would be similar to what they have been given. As the teams were assembled to a 50 pt limit, I cant imagine a team full of PL riders would drop that much... You say a limit has already been decided at 42, then it has obviously been forecast that those riders are going to drop the score significantly. Cant see that. 2 or 3 pts probably, but 8 is excessive. Teams made up with loaded EL averages are a different proposition. They will lose their 1.4 loading and will expect to make the aver up riding against lesser competition. Top riders like Holder, Doyle, Lindgren should make up that loading, but lesser EL riders will find it very hard indeed to make up the difference.. This will show when those new figures become available. I hope that new riders are treated the same as the one's already earmarked to ride. The last thing we want to see is 'Ringers' brought in to fill loop holes that have been overlooked.

I think there are going to be a few surprises when the first set of figures become the level of the reality especially after the loading of 1.4 is taken away from Elite averaged riders. The teams with the majority of 'Premier' riders will stay fairly stagnate to level they started, the season, whereas those teams employing Elite riders , more likely than not, will see their total figure reduced . It will be interesting to see how the BSPA see this in the terms of creating a new points level for future rider changes..., Another query regarding riders and their averages: When we have passed into first new set of points scheduling period and riders need to be replaced for whatever reason, am I right in thinking that all new riders of elite standing will be subject to the 1.4 loading that the other riders were calculated too, at the start. Technically they should be, Because our teams are made up using PL averages, any replacement used, who have no PL scores has to bring his CMA in line with everybody else......

Depends what you want to know. We won the Spring Gold Cup a preseason comp, We knocked Poole out of the KO Cup with Betts and Simmo getting 15pt Max, before losing to Reading the Semi-final. Anders Michanek beat Ole Olsen in the Pride of the East Run-Off; Simmo finished the season with a 10.26 aver; and John Louis equalled Bettsy's track record at 68.8sec..

We will never agree on this one You seem to interpretate the comments to suit your argument. To me knowledge of the sport is a fundamental requirement, that's knowing what is going on, knowing the recent scores, knowing of important happenings, knowing of future meetings and important dates, knowing of bad crashes and current injuries, and knowing the relevance of the league positions and the importance of the points at stake. Coupled with the basic rules of the sport, that is what I refer to as ' Knowledge of the Sport'. I don't see the relevance of what happened in 1973 as an argument in this situation, or that of the whole Speedway History. It's nice to know a few facts but its not so important To me 'Knowledge' in far more beneficial than 'Research'. 'Knowledge' is something that has been acquired and is inbreed, whereas 'Research' is a get-out of jail card for somebody who doesn't know...... Two totally different applications....

Good Morning !! , Obviously you are in a contemptuous mood with your reply, the only reason I showed part of your comment was the part I have a problem with. I agreed with the rest.. Of course you need a sense of humour and be able to hold the hold, but foremost you need that knowledge of the sport. To say that is not so is ridiculous... If or when you project the competence, of someone who knows what he's talking about, it will be far easier to hold their interest. If you cant do that you're on a loser to start with.. Once you have their attention, then its not what you say but how it comes across.

Pleased to see Batchelor is continuing to impress in his native land. He top scored in the heats of Rd3 in the Aussie Championship only to lose out in the final. This form has to bode well for the coming season and show those doubters that form is only temporary whereas skill is more permanent .. Congratulations also to Justin Sedgmen , not only for leading the point charts but also showing those who doubted him, what a fine prospect he really is..,

Lynn first replacement, after MB had gone, made a mockery of that statement. He knew all about Kings Lynn from his Stack Car days but knew sod all about speedway. He was happy to call the riders by the wrong names and get excited over very little... Fortunately he didn't last very long....

If only it was that easy. Having travelled to most venues, we were fortunate to have MB he was as good as they come. Replacing such talent was always going to be difficult. I don't blame Buster because there are not many out there to find. We need someone with and in-depth knowledge of the sport (that's the easy part) but someone who is confident and has an appealing personality on the mic. (No doubt there are a few of them about as well, but to find someone who has both attributes is unbelievably hard).... Without doubt MB was the best of them all.......

That's probably right, but the thought of him riding in all 3 leagues could be really detriment to his development ... Obviously it matters.... You say the positions will be changed when the first set of figures come out, but that's purely conjecture as the new team points limit has yet to be decided. If say Lynn start off well and the team 1 to 6 are scoring good points, then there will not be any leeway to make reserve changes.... Obviously the Promoters will be looking for a young, improving rider, on a low average, who will benefit from riding in the top league, not one who will be dropped and changed if his scoring is slow to develop. If a defeat was created because the reserve scored few points, then the other 1 to 6 should have more of the responsibility to perform, than an out of depth Reserve No 7

Like everyone else, I imagined young Josh Bailey would have been tailor made for that 7 position. Obviously he had talks with the Lynn bosses before signing for Scunthorpe and the Young Stars, So this idea of riding for all 3 leagues has to be a 'no-goer' Surely, had he been in the frame for the Elite side then he wouldn't have been allowed to signed for Scunthorpe . . So although the promoters, are said to be keeping their option open, have in fact excepted Josh will not be at No 7. We must wait with anticipation that we acquire the right man.

Nobody is asking for a 'every minute of the day' attitude, merely to be kept in the picture of the current situation. A morning bulletin would satisfy most people and would show the wheels are actually turning. Hearing nothing only add to the uncertainty. I don't see how keeping fans informed takes anything away from the discussions that are taken place. What is so delicate that the fans mustn't know. We have 3 parties to negotiate a solution. Eventually whether the club is saved or doomed the people responsible will be named or shamed, so why all the secrecy?? It is my view of life , that if anything has been done in secret, then usually it has been done underhanded, and that my biggest fear..... When deals are done in the open, you don't get 'back handers' , deceptions nor bribes . Deals are secured on good honest endeavour. Probably I expect too much........

I don't get this attitude of 'when we have some news we will tell you' , No doubt they are aware this situation is critical, the well-being of an iconic Speedway Club is at stake here. With only a few weeks before the season starts the situation should be developing every day. If not, then it should be, The fans who have supported the club for years wants to know the current state of the proceedings and should be kept in the picture every day.. The promoters are burying their heads here, not keeping the fans informed, whereas they should be getting all the help and support possible in the hours that lay ahead. Each day that passes with no movement is another day lost. The project just keeps getting harder and harder . How long before this becomes impossible to succeed???. What development happened yesterday? What is expected today??. what is the plan for the next few days?? We the fans deserve to know this .. We want to know if the outlook is good or is it as bad as it looks. Being treated like Mushrooms is not ideal for anyone,,.... or anything...... ..

A lot to be said about local rivalry, In our best supported years we always had the added fans from nearby by clubs. Ipswich and Peterborough always brought a big following when we race them and likewise we would take impressive numbers when racing away. Leicester could also be added to that group, but because the distance was getting near to 100miles the following wasn't as great... With all this talk about one league was on-going this year, my thoughts were directed to the rekindling of those wonderful local derbies, all to no avail. But they did generate a lot of local interest.....

Nice to see Batchelor continuing his winning run in Aussie land . Congratulations is in order on winning the South Australian Championship with a 15pts max. Keep it going Troy........,,

Me too !!!! I'm of the same impression. I've been to Brandon more years than I care to remember and my feelings are sad at the demise of what was once the mecca of our sport. I prey, I am wrong, but until I see actual work being done I'm afraid, my feeling won't change...... Why have the 'Powers of B' allowed the sport to continue this downward spiral??? Surely they realised the danger of their self preservation attitude, would always end up this way...

Same as you, I thought Josh Bailey was a nailed on certainty. He would be ideal candidate for a reserve place. Its all very well riding in the National league and scoring high points, but to experience racing with the big boys would a tremendous benefit to him . He would get all the encouragement to progress along the way. I think it would be wrong if he was overlooked in preference to someone new to this club. What statement would that be to all those young, up and coming riders, who want to progress to the top League....