stratton

75 only? For 81 , they would dream of that gate now what does Cardiff get 50?

They might all have lovely race suits to suit now, but go back to the 60s and 70s they certainly had more TEAM players riders who team rode and were proper team men today is not the same.

The quote from the late Great John Berry says it all surely you take what he said seriously.?

No, No,No, i went to Hyde Rd and The Shay in the 80s Courtney,Mckinna,Holloway,Glanz also at The Shay Hunter,Willmott,Holloway,Glanz heat 2 races two races often you might of scored zilch and were on your way home.You have a rethink and then get back to me .

Not in the EL they ain't , !

Funny thing Addio is when I first started going my uncle said Briggo at times gated terrible, but would pick em off.He said i will put a 12point max in already, but you are right Briggs could at times gate very well.I remember when he came back for Hull at the Abbey in 76 had a exclusion in heat 1 but after that gated like a long dog very quick indeed but he along with PC are the most exciting riders i ever saw.

Gater Bob Kilby ,racer The great Briggo.

is he ?

Are you being a twit or not? Not a fool and ask Davey fans family and sponsors Ipswich fans whether he was a mug or not,remember what BERRY said he knows more in his left hand than you will ever know.So Iris get off your high horse have a think and maybe you might come up with something i doubt it !!

Harsh and i will and Havant a guess you never really went to Foxhall much ? i only went three times but unless you are a nomark you must no that Louis,Sanders,Davey were a pretty nice 1/2/3.

Well to be honest Iris av a cup of tea cool down but unless you think Davey got lucky to be a helmet challenger to PC who was a champion he was nominated he did well you tell me? av a look back Davey deserved his challenge!

I believe Davey challenged PC for the helmet did very well this was against Collins who was a bugger to beat.Tony Davey had horrendous injuries over a period but that one or two years he really pushed on he was unlucky he was in the same team as Louis/Sanders both great riders.

You say pick the same old same old most years? No you have a vision stick with it over a period have faith, Tai and Harris pick themselves the rest is open for me.

I have to agree with you,i am a Swindon fan and i can't wait to watch Rose everyweek.But for the life of me why were the Lynn penalised? they showed vision created young riders yet were punished for it.

I think you will find that PC and Briggs won plenty of races on smallish tracks , Collins i saw loads of times in his pomp around Reading(ect) superb he was not just a flat out round the boards merchant.In a way you would of thought PC would become a one trick pony around the mighty Hyde Rd but he was adaptable a brilliant allround motorcyclist.

Witcher another point you did not mention and maybe others will often some of the stronger riders did not always ride at no 1 so the old format was not always a cakewalk.Collins,Crump,Sjosten,( ect) rode at three or five so the opposing no 1 did not have an easy time.The heat 8 was often the cream for the No1 and he usually won his tactical.But my main point which i have tried to point out to you,teams then because most had star no1s that's what made speedway for me that's why i am passionate about this subject.Often you might only see a visiting no1 once a year unless you see them maybe in a individual meeting the teams 16/18 in a league.That is what i remember going early on a Saturday to usually see a star no 1 everyweek.I don't now go on Thursday now believing that not since Leigh went anyway so my memory might be playing tricks but whatever i enjoyed the times.

I understand the point about averages i get that, but as a example say at Ipswich lLouis/Sanders/Davey ok take 1.5 off all there averages Louis 9.00. Sanders 8.50 Davey 7.50 and i am being generous with 1.5 deductions.And who is to say they would not of coped with the changes? but my main point is eaces1 those three riders i named would still be very good riders indeed do you understand that point.?Say Mauger's 11.74 was down to 10.30 and that with his gating prowess is a doubt he would still be a great do you see my point now?Maybe if you took 1.5 off all averages my opinion of these riders in that list does not change at all because of a lower average.

I found in a old 1985 Halifax v King,s Lynn programme, in which Michael Lee did not ride his career stats at the shay.Eight meeting's his lowest score 2 points his highest score 17 points for an overall career average of 6.91.Anyone who were fans of Lee has to get the Carter DVD,awesome he rode the shay like he rode when he won the long track final.How he never won at Norden god knows but thing's were set up for Egon.Also on this DVD Carter's demolition of Nielsen 2.0 is breathtaking to.

It has to be Stokes surely? the ruling stopping Rose riding this year for the Lynn really looks a ridiculous one.

I think you have had to much drink my friend,Cook comparable to Louis (ect) i am glad i don't grasp what you are trying to get me to agree to.Laughable really ask the old timers on here if a Cook ( forget your gates stats) is comparable to a LOUIS.Others on here will no better than me about the Tiger, i was lucky to see him ride about four times a year but at certain times in his career he was good anough to be a world champion ER summed it up perfectly for me. Alot of good riders Witcher ie) an example John Cook did not get a assessed 6.00 average in his first season it was hard.Examples debut season in the BL.J.Cook,4.17. Ermolenko, 6.71(full season 4 matches the year before) S.Moran 6.47 Doncaster 6.07. Tatum 6.19. jJonsson 6.52. J.Andersson 4.56 why didn't these rack up great figures because they had to learn there craft in a tough league with different challenges at different tracks.

Those examples you have given to me ER says it all, Witcher maybe should have a rethink.Only Zagar for me out of those riders is an in/out no1 Andersen even in his pomp and in a watered down product was borderline.Those riders say it all for me then add Kylmakorki,Watt,Harris,Bjerre, what a difference in quality.

None of those reserve choices that UK Martin has suggested are good anough,Lawson forget his age would get the nod over those four all night long was John Louis at 28/29 to old to ride for England.? I agree totally no help for the young uns,no long term vision year after year just plodding along.

Bloody hell a hell of a placement, some tribute eh some great riders then bits i have seen I see he wore a white scarf and the ladies loved him but ( ie) he could race so exciting to watch.

Just the man Norbold,have been getting a collection together of Arthur Forrest mostly Halifax at the moment i know he reached 5 World finals.And in his first year in div 3 he scored 19 maximums four paid how good was he Norbold.?

Merry Christmas to all you budgie fans and have a great day tomorrow,and SHOCKER don't get to p....d.