stratton

I think BFD he is far from a amateur and certainly is not blinkered its only his opinion at the end of the day.Ive learned loads off him,since i have been reading regularly on the forum and for me thats what it is all about NO RIGHT or WRONG only debate.

Lee won a longtrack title PC didnt individually Lee would be in front won British titles Commonwealth titles endless others.Lee rode in 6 finals 1 win a 4th and two 3rds thats at least on par with p.c isnt it? if not better.

On the Lee v Collins debate it is very close between them Lee,s B.L record was pretty good also?My take is both at there best on say 10 different tracks Lee for me would be the victor.This exspecially on the smaller slicker tracks apart from Hyde rd a peak Lee would beat Collins more often than not. Lee taking P.C for 2nd on the last bend from the back in 1980 won him the title.

I wondered about Langton you have mentioned him before chunky Ashby i know a underachiever. But he for me is up with the Boococks Louis,and others even though his cv dosent look that healthy all great names though.

Really interested by your knowledge and opinion both my kids who are football mad both say i dont give recent present day players anough credit.In your list a top 50 you would have alot of 1970s onwards players in it but it is very hard.Looking at a different angle a few players who i have seen live but wouldnt be in a top 30 are CURRIE, BOWLES,LETISSIER,HODDLE,BRADY,D.THOMAS,HEIGHWAY,D.CLEMENT, I.GILLARD.COWANS,MCDERMOTT. ECT) Great list and are all spot on really my only change would be that Kichen, Forrest, Ashby would have to be in the 2nd level thats only going on i believe some you have named they are on par with.

A few there you have named i would disagree Ronaldinho,certainly no way .Where is Keegan(european player of the year twice) Charlton, Moore,Rummengge, difficult i know alot of them from 1980 wouldnt be knowhere near a alltime top 20 for me top 50 yes.

A very strange decision? wouldnt be so bad if they replaced him with someone better.Loyalty works both ways anyway Ashworth hopefully will benefit, in my view a very talented rider and should be averaging 9 in the PL.

I dont think Ashworth considered going to Plymouth Oldace if that was the case do you?Treated shabilly in my opinion because of the pathetic rules we have in speedway he didnt get the El meetings he wanted to boost his income.These riders are the bread and butter of the sport and they risk there lives and deserve rewarding did Sheffield show him any LOYALTY?

And he probably would of done another 10 years, at Sheffield, you would think Ricky deserved better than that.He would be the first bloke i would of had signed everyyear all he wanted to do was make a decent living good luck at Berwick Ricky.

I think theyre are only 2 options you could have less fixtures but the quality of rider higher maybe ?( ie Crump, Jonsson, Hancock willing to ride less fixtures. Or what i would prefer reshape everything ride say 40 odd fixtures without the stars.I dont know how others feel but i am sick to death of the SGP circus affecting our league programme and us bowing down to there every need. Time to move on i feel even if we dont see the stars, saying that we only have 4 riding anyway or the more to totally restructure.our league programme.

Weird Steve in 73 i see him Christer he did make an impression on me.I think i see him 3 times the last time for the hawks first time i was only 8 was a pocket dynamite.,

See him at Swindon in 1973 that Daily Mirror meeting at Swindon broke the tapes? in heat 1. Was lucky to stay in Redmond the N.Z manager went mad he went out and broke the track record a exciting talent in a way reminds me of Ward.

Wondered if anyone had any speedway mails from 1973 /74 / 75 they were willing to sell.Will be interested some on ebay insane prices 4.99 each not paying that if so get in touch thanks.

Maybe i am wrong way off, but i really think Cassius Clay/ Ali had a massive affect on money going into sport so many people have him to thank.

Yes you are right as usual Grachan memory superb did Neil Evitts ride as a 14 or 15 year old?

Do you go on achievements silverware? or what they did for the sport generally it is so difficult.Personally a (ex) Rickardsson would be for me behind Mauger,,Briggs Fundin Olsen and Nielsen but when you look at it logically that is madness really, just my opinion more and likely it is wrong.As Oldace says can we be blinded by sentiment when analysing these things.

I dont think there is a danger of the greats being forgotten,in most sports if the word GREAT or LEGEND is used correctly there isnt that many.Examples for me my opinion only as norbold says L.Sullivan Johnson Dempsey would be in boxings all time 20 boxing greats.Joe Davis in snookers top 10 Mathews in top 20 in football.I dont know what people think? i have been watching sport for 40 years and i think we overate sportsmen or women of recent years say since 1980.In football for ex) since 1980 Zidane Maradona (a cheat cheated the public and himself), Messi are the only players for me that would be anywhere near a alltime top 20.Am i wrong is the word great bandied about to easily.

I think comparing sports stars is very difficult do you go on personnal exsperience watching live with the eye?Or do you just go to the stats and build your opinion on the imformation available.I have been watching sport for 40 years and the change is unbelievable really but my opinion is class would be class in any era.English riders in recent years which makes the decision easy like someone said Craven went in 62 Collins and Lee in the 80s.Only Loram and Wigg for me would be mentioned in the real top scale of things who knows Harris hasnt finished yet and he certainly isnt finished yet.

My feeling on Lee and Collins is that it was very close hard to choose.I decided on Lee because i feel Lee,s total best was better than Peter,s best.I hazard a guess Peter,s record against Mike was better than most prob level? Lee,s record for ex) against say Nielsen ,Penhall,Gundersen,Mauger,is excellent also i wouldnt have Craven along way ahead of the other two greats.

Thanks Gauntlet for that, thought Charley was underage for his debut was highly rated. ,,

Wondered if anyone could help i know Shawn Moran rode under a ussumed name of David East was that in the usa or second halves at Hull?Howard Cole first rode under the name Kid Bodie was he underage and changed names later?. Trevor Charley of Stoke potters i know he rode was very young but my yearbook is up in my loft cant find it does anyone have any averages for him think it was 1976/77 thanks.

Huge year for Barker he has impressed me i think he will take alot of beating anywhere in the PL.

I must admit when the masters series started i really liked the vision.i didnt enjoy the Berger g prix meetings at all to be honest.For all i say the gp series does work and maybe just 6 to 8 meetings is the answer or is it just a money making cow? i dont know.

I think Lee, Nielsen, Sanders, Carter, Sigalos, were the best 5 riders i see in 1983.I think all of them can feel unlucky because they all probably would of beat Muller 7 times out of 10 but on the day he was flying.I got there Norden at 6 in the morning and it was chucking it down had heard Muller had had loads of practice still didnt think he would win it though.See Lee that month and thought he would take some stopping Muller was top notch and i enjoyed watching him ride.

Did we have ONE undeserving in 1973? thats not to bad is it since the birth of speedway.