waiheke1

Pertinent and insightful as always Starry...

I've never heard anyone say the super rugby scoring system of 4 for a win, 2 for a draw, one for losing by 7 or less points and one for scoring 3 or more triea us ridiculous or too hard to explain to casual fans. Or is it just that kiwis and,hard though it may be to believe, Aussies are smarter than British sports fans?

Why is that ridiculous? How us it any different to point systems used in rugby or cricket for example? The people you know can't be too bright if they find that system too confusing - either that or someone is not very good at explaining it!

I agree. This could Be mitigated having 2 fixed nights for PL (CL could run the other 5 nights) . Job done. Then plan fixtures better (eg font schedule a meeting featuring GP riders on a GP Saturday. Don't schedule a meeting featuring fricke ot lambert to clash with world u21 champs. Don't schedule a meeting featuring too Danes to clash with the Dsnish final). Common sense per the above would I'm sure remove 90% of non injury related unavailability. And I don't think fans have an issue with facility for a genuinely injured rider.

The issue by all accounts is not listening to those who understood what as needed to make a good track. It's not rocket science - don't make the straights too long or the turns too sharp and make sure there is enough width? Model it on a track that has a similar size to work with that produces good racing.

And I font disagree with that. But let's not get rid of riders like Morris or Lindgren or Bjerre just because they may miss the odd meeting.I'd start by restricting doubling up to Brits, planning fixtures properly, restrict the top flight to two race nights per week, a minimum number of Brits per team. Attach something like a 5 as the minimum average for a foreign rider for team building. That would be a starting point. I'd also be interested to see the stats for riders missing due to doubling up vs those riding overseas. And how many of those overseas fixture clashes could have been avoided due to sensible fixture planning. Or just a modicum of competence (refer Morris and the farce of the fours)

Butt you just brought that "of all time" into ot. It is clear everyone elder has been saying that at the current time Poole are the biggest club. If you talk "all time" then Preston North End are one of the biggest clubs. But reality is that now they are not. You can hardly call Cradley or voventry big clubs now, despite their history. Id say Poole, Aces then probably Wolves. Taking into account success, crowds, name recognition etc.

Yes riders ride only two nights a week in the uk. But that could be a Monday and Wednesday one week, a Thursday and Saturday the next a Tuesday and Sunday the one after. Therefore by committing to make the uk a priority they would be unable to ride in an overseas league without the probability that at some time they would have a clash of fixtures.Point 2 referred to the complaints of unfairness and illegality when the poles requested riders sign a contract giving priority to their club

The issue with that is:1. Committing to racing in the UK means being available 7 race nights a week, compared to 1 in any other European league 2.have you seen the whinging about the poles doing this?

According to the KL thread Buster tried to redeclare KL with an illegal side (only one ride who has been NL elegible (. If you have the chairman trying to cheat... If my local sold 4.50 pints I'm sure I'd be drinking too many as well! Though did you say overpriced?

Has been mentioned a few times in this thread as 3000

What I find odd is that people think riders "owe" British speedway something. If my employer trains me while I work, do I "owe them" anything more than giving 100% effort while I work for them? If a footballer joins a lower league club, do the fans or club complain if they move onto bigger and better things? If people go to see a movie with an unknown actor, does that actor somehow "owe" the fans something? Or do all parties actually benefit when a young talent rides in bits in? The rider develops his skills and gets paid. The club has a ruder who performs well (if he doesn't he's likely to be dropped). The fans get to see a talented young rider - does it matter where they are from? Most Audries have actually been pretty loyal to the UK. Sure part of it is likely to be that they prefer to live here than Europe. Sure some of them have a reputation for whinging. But fact is that Doyle Ward Batch Holder etc have all consistently rode in Britain, unlike others such as Hancock, Nicki P etc. People say earlier riders like Crump, Sanders and Adams showed greater commitment to the UK than the current crop. But you can guarantee that they, Mauger etc would have prioritised Poland if that is where the money, and the top standard of racing, was. Not saying we should be doormats - I would restrict doubling up to brits and would have given both thorssel and jolder a ban - but some of the criticism of aussies on here is way out of proportion. And the hypocrisy of those who have whinged about polish regulations but see no irony in demanding they be put in place in the uk- is staggering.

And do you think British speedway is better for the absence of anericans/Australians/kiwis.Personally I think it would have been poorer if the likes of Penh all, Morals, Ward etc had not graced these shores. OK england/Britain might have had more success on the world stage, but our domestic league and world speedway would have been much poorer for it.

And tbh you could give 5 nights to championship clubs, if they are prepared to deal with the fact that it means a greater probability of riders missing due to other commitments.

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Tbh from a racing perspective that wouldn't be a bad thing...

If they didn't give the OK then he would have got a 28 day ban?

Why should the FIM have the ability to dictate the contract terms Polish clubs are able to offer independent contractors? It's not a bad idea, but I struggle to see the plus side for the Polish clubs.From the British side, if say Doyle gets replaced by a young Pole, neither the club nor fans win I'd also say cost is an issue, flying and sending equipment to the UK for a one off meeting is unlikely to be costveffectuve for rider or club. I agree though that it's not a battle UK clubs will win. Surely the first step in trying to reach an agreement with any other nation wouldcbevmoving to fixed race night/s.

Don't understand the VISA comment?Your example doesn't really make sense, we are talking about an almost identical situation happening two weeks ago.generally if you have two identical cases goto court in a 2 week period you would expect the same verdict in both?

Yes I am. It was an utter balls up by the BSPA and I'm not saying he should be punished, simply pointing out the rules.Or which part do u disagree with?

I agree and as I stated above you can't blame him.At the same time, the rules don't allow riders to miss the meeting due to fixture clash or BSPA incompetence.

Tbh if the BSPA can announce 5 ruder heats and then retract that, withdraw two teams and then put them back in, I don't think you can blame Morris for riding in Poland instead...BUT the rules that are seemingly being used against Holder would seemingly still apply to Morris

Wonder if he will be as prompt and decisive on condemning KL for the sub standard team fielded at Leicester? Or the illegal team they allegedly tried to redeclare?Would also add that after the utter farce around heat formats it is laughable for Buster to be lauding this as one of the premier events of the calendar. Surely the BSPA shambles brings the event into far more disrepute than a young rider taking an opportunity overseas?

I fully agree. My view is that both were wrong and noth riders should have copped a ban for witholding services or clubs punished if they allow it.But it is hypocritical and unfair to allow one - with facility- but condemn another. I fully agree. My view is that both were wrong and noth riders should have copped a ban for witholding services or clubs punished if they allow it.But it is hypocritical and unfair to allow one - with facility- but condemn another.

Surely it's also hypocritical, given Thorssel was allowed to skip an EL match for a rescheduled Polish match?