waiheke1

You are aware that the "doping" infringement dudek committed wasnt of the funny cigarette type, and is actually a legal substance? Yoyr argument is a bit like saying someone who is licensed to carry a gun and commits an offence with it is not as bad as someone who used illegal brass knuckles to commit the same offence.

Yes I did hsve it wrong. Looks like darcy was under uk drink drive limit (37mcg for breath test), but closer to the limit than to zero.

if i interpret correctly, that would be over the drink drive limit in NZ which is 400mg for breath test and 80mg for blood test (looks like Darcy was 500mg and100mg in breath/blood respectively, if I'm reading correctly. If that's the case, then he must have had a pretty big session to be blowing that at lunchtime, and has to be looking at the rest of the season surely? Though, that doesn't seem to tie back to Phil's assertion that he may have passed a test four hours later, where I understand he would hav eneeded a close to zero reading?

I think it's a fair comparison tbh. Both amongst the greatest natural talents of all time in their respective sports. Both have achieved at club level, without doing the same at the sports pinnacle (in bests case tbf due to his nationality).I'd argue there is actually quite a fine line between being an alcoholic and "just" having a drinking problem.

Except one drink, or even four, and he would almost certainly not have been over the limit the following day....I'd suggest the amount drunk is of quite dome importance as to the level of risk he was potentially putting others at.

Puk is nki

Darcy reminds me a lot of nz cricketer jesse ryder. Everytime it seems he has turned the corner, he stuffs up again. I suspect hes not helped by his circle of mates - certainly the darcy crew I was sat next to at western springs were all trollied by the start of the meeting. Maybe he needs a manager who will tell him when he's being a dickhead. Hope his ban is not too severe though. Rehabilitation rather than punishment for the sake of it - a meeting if he had a low level the seadon if he was over drink drive limit. Would be a real shame to be missing both emil andcdarcy next year.

Agree, a very good meeting. Kk very impressive, nicki looked the quickest he has all season, and gregs gating was as always top class. Really enjoyed it, shame it's been overshadowed by the debacle the day before and darcys exploits.

What would bring you back oldace? The new stadium? Return of star riders to the el? Knowing the meeting would be slickly presented and completed in an hour and a half? The starting point for reviving the elshould surely be winning back lapsed fans, as if the product is right they should be easier targets than strangers to the sport.

Sid - the BL was undisputably stronger I the "old days." The vast majority of the world's top riders raced here - in the 80s the only exceptions were some of the yanks and Egon. I'm not sure all teams had three top heat leaders -statistically, you're always going to end up with an average three riders per team with decent averages under the old heat format), but that doesn't make them all "top class" -and there were some incredibly weak teams (i'm thinking Eastborne/Swindon in 83, Halifax in 84 after Carter got injured) - weaker I would say than any current EL team - but some incredibly strong teams too (Cradley 83 were simply awesome). For the most part I'd say teams weren't as strong as the current Swedish/Polish top teams, purely because top riders were spread over 15 rather than 8 sides. I'd also suggest the Poole team last year (Ward, Janowski, Holder) would have been a top side in any given season in the old days. Matt Ford has man many flaws, and I detest the cheating Poole indulge in, but he does put out strong sides, and if every team in the EL could put out sides of that caliber the EL would be in much better shape. If we are to get back to having top riders and regular 1-7, a single race night (or max two) is needed, along with the EL to have priority over PL for all fixtures, and I'd allow guests/RR only for heatleaders (a PL rider could act as "number 8" cover for second strings, and a local junior/NL rider to cover the reserve slots - that's how I remember it working in the 80s?). was it good that they rode in such atrocious conditions though? Maybe if Peter Collins hadn't had to ride in poor conditions ar Cradlet in 1980 he would have been a world class rider for another 5 years. For more of today's riders speedway is also their full time job, hence it's understandable that they are more risk averse when it comes to putting their future earning son the line? I'm not sure on the whole the racing in the EL is worse than the old BL days, though some of the best racers tracks are gone (Hyde Rd, the Shay, Odsal etc.) and certainly it has lower quality of rider (relative to world standards) - the latter is the main criticism people seem to have of the current EL, yet at the same time many are proposing cutting back further on the number of top riders racing here.

thanks R&R, best of luck to the remaining competitors

You do know that most energy drinks contain caffeine, which is actually dehydrating, don't you? Darcy surely not that stupid???? ROFL!

Dont want to defend darcy, clearly he has been stupid (agsin) but... Kelly moran is one of the most loved speedway riders of all time, one of the "characters" that we are told modern speedway is lacking. Yet he was reputedly so pissed one meeting that he fell at the first bend every time. A one meeting gp ban (in addition to the one just missed) would be about right imo. Hope he sorts himself out, would be such a waste if he ends up another mike lee (and lee at least won a world title). Edit: One match GP ban assumes not drunk at test time, but rather a very low positive reading. If he was say over the drink/drive limit, then a ban for the rest of the season would seem appropriate. plenty of people advocate a zero tolerance level for drink driving. And a diss-proportionate number of accidents involve people who are under the alcohol limit, but have alcohol reading, that's precisely why some argue for zerol tolerance...

Mikebv. What is your proposed solution? Guests and r/r have been around for 40+ years and noone seems to have found a practical solution. What do u suggest? Teams track a local junior in case of missing a rider?

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I prefer the tac sub rule too. But its nonsense for people to say it's less unfair or less of a joke than the current double point ride rule.

Phil - you pointed out that bsi are incurring some extra costs due to this debacle. Mine was that its hard to feel any sympathy for them.Id also suggest that if they want to make speedway truly global, surely it is in their interests for promoters not to be losing shed loads. Would be interested to know what the few things bill b should have done differently to save him the two million bucks he lost. Final point is that surely bsi need to take some responsibility when things go wrong, not just take platitudes when things go right (and cash regardless).

In some cases I don't think a rehearsal would be practical - it wouldn't have been at western springs for example. Would be interesting to get a true view as to whether the track would have been raceable without yesterday's rain. If it would, then maybe a test meeting wouldn't have proved anything?

With due respect phil, bsi are still going to make a decent profit from this season though aren't they? More than can be said for bill buckley or the riga promoters. Surely the series is theirs, so they need to take some responsibility when things go wrong. As others have mentioned, organising foc cosch transport would have been a way of showing respect for the fans, and is hardly going to bankrupt them.

The quality of racing in the gps is, generally speaking, miles better than the old world finals. Partly due to the fact that all riders have something to race for every heat, and you dont have a quarter/third of the field being sub-standard riders.

Dont think it needs translating. All teams seem to have been able to tun Mondays for sky meetings, so if we eent to a single race night, monday would seem ok for all/most tracks. Does anyone have a definitive list of tracks that couldn't race homr meetings on s monday or thursday? Twk - I did almost add a rider that some are opposed to both. Not sure you can argue tactical rides are csusing speedway to lose credibility though - they have been around since before my firstspeedway meeting 81), so the credibility is long gone if your argument holds true.your comment re diehards - surely the point has already been reached where only the diehards remain? As for your last point - dont you consistently argue that the pl is a better product? That would surely indicate that you yhink the standard of rider is not the key measure of product quality and therefore introduction of ftr doesnt necessarily mean dilution of product?

Ditto! Will have to try to convince my boss that I need to conduct some training for my Aussie collleagues october next year. Edit: so Melbourne not sydney? Brother has just moved to Melbourne so thay could be ideal.

If fast track riders are askng for too much money from their pl and nl clubs, why dont those clubs just say no? Re the airfares, if the polish and swedish clubs are paying much higher wages, that would explain why they expect riders to pay their own airfares?

SCB - you can still download the flying shale game for a free trial, if you want to see what it looks like, basics of how it works etc. http://roogames.co.uk/fs.htm Bwitcher - I only had the original Speedway scene, do you know what the changes make for the 2" version were? I played Speedway Scene endlessly as a kid - so many yeasr on, I can still, tragic as it is, remember pretty much every grading card from A+ down to about G, and tell you every rider from every BL team's grade for the 82 season!