Hawk127

If that Is the best you have it confirms what I said. I run a successful business and just enjoy reading pathetic responses like yours. Time to do something interesting so I will leave you to your arguments.

Have you ever thought about trying to put together a sentence that makes sense with the correct punctuation. You also ought to think about your grammar and consider your construction of a balanced argument as your failure on both counts leaves a lot to be desired. I doubt that few if any can take you seriously and however much you complain, insult and show your opposition to to an ageing population, which you continually portray throughout your posts, you simply belittle your standing in terms of being taken seriously but I doubt you even understand that. Winge as much as you like about the older generation but at least most of us have had a life, have had an education and show respect for others all of which seems to escape you and is beyond your comprehension.

Thanks for confirming the Hackney meeting. Memory not what it use to be. Time to crawl back under the stone.

Local derbies and cup competitions are sadly missing from today’s racing calendar as the average fickle supporter cannot see beyond a league meeting. If you have more competitions, it means more track time for riders more trophies and not just a league or KO cup. I remember many competitions at Rayleigh, Essex Gold Cup against Romford, 3TT involving Canterbury and Eastbourne, local derbies involving the two aforementioned teams plus Ipswich, Romford and Crayford and the resultant bragging rights plus some real humdingers against Boston, Sunderland, Berwick, Workington and many more. Most clubs would be overjoyed to see the numbers that attended Rayleigh on Saturday or bank holiday. Nothing today comes near the package those of us who were lucky enough to experience or the enthusiasm of those on the terraces.

Absolutely brilliant and that is what a team World Cup should be. Seven riders and a knock out tournament. No messing about at the start and a passionate crowd. I remember going to the round at Hackney and it was Russia but for the life of me I cannot remember the opponents but the stadium was packed. Oh happy days and if only they would give the same format a try today.

If you believe that every club and every rider relies solely on gate money you are sadly deluded. None of the clubs have orbwould exist without sponsors and riders could not afford to participate without sponsorship. In the case of younger riders starting out family money keeps them in the sport. If you have ever written a business plan and supported it with financial forecasts including p and l, balance sheet and cash flow you can demonstrate how it could be a viable proposition. Your idea of doing it on the back of a fag packet without any business acumen says it all. Run a business and you might have some idea. If you do run a business then I would be surprised if it has any longevity given your comments.

Comparing today’s whinging Aussies with those who had track craft and skills way above the likes of Schlein etc is not looking through rose tinted glasses. Yes they did argue and often complained but they also showed respect for the paying punter and gave it their best.

You talk solely about gate money. What about sponsorship? What about the bigger picture? Forget it you still have not divulged a decent forecast or businessmodel and amateur business people are not worth debating with.

What serious calculation or business model have you run through to conclude that clubs will go bust? I think you have not thought it through and are shooting from the hip. Come up with your financial forecasts on a club by club basis to prove th3 point and you might be taken seriously. If clubs are able to pull in a bigger fan base over the qualifying period and it hits the spot in value for money more people would attend and almost replicate the Polish scenario. The Polish fans pay nothing like the U.K. fan base have to cough up but as the cream rises to the top you pay more but everyone starts off with a chance. The trouble is no one wants to try anything new and yet you continually criticise those who refer back to age when the sport was popular and pulling in decent crowds unlike today when it is not a secret that is best kept, it simply has changed to the point where no one is interested and the price point is wrong for those attending and the riders believe that are better then they really are with the promoters operating on a self interest basis. If it were free it would be too much to pay but could happen with the right sponsorship but no one in this sport is capable of achieving that.

Why not try something different if the play offs are such a big attraction. All qualifying meetings are £7.50 adults and £1 for children. Top six teams in the play offs charge £20 per adult £2 per child. For the final charge £30 per adult and £5 per child. See how popular they are with the fans on cost versus importance of meeting. Make it something special in the final and possibly an event rather than just a meeting and see whether it is a good as those who believe it is.

Does that prove the point. I bet you were entertained, had admiration for the riders and probably left happy having been entertained even if things were a bit hairy. All that excitement and I bet each and every one at least tried unlike their peers who are clearly overpaid to the point where that they can afford not to race every week or perhaps doubling up has taken away the incentive to serve the paying public and show some allegiance to club and fans.

Few if any of today’s Aussie riders have either the class or the refinement or the skill of some of their former compatriots. Jason Crump, Shane Parker, Billy Sanders, Jason Lyons, Craig Boyce, Ryan Sullivan etc. would give it a go and get on with the job most of the time. The current crop believe they are better then they really are which is a shame but no one can stand a whinging Aussie rider. Many of the current riding fraternity cannot entertain the public let alone stand up and be counted when asked to talk to joe public to justify a decision. Who in their right mind would want to run a club where the tail is wagging the dog. At least at NL level few seem to have the fear factor that is all to evident by those with supposedly more experience.

No one forgets this but unless the conditions are perfect the riders are refusing to get a meeting on. If they perceive the risks are too great and this is becoming the norm where anything other than perfect conditions (which is a personal rider view rather than a collective team view) is an excuse not to ride then find another job. This simply did not happen in years gone by but today’s riders are unwilling to give it a go and if they fear they cannot control the machines then it is something that they need to deal with and adapt the bikes accordingly but it is not the paying public who should be punished for these riders lack of skills in tackling the conditions.

It has always been a case of their body on the line. Don’t disagree on that but these are suppose to be professional riders who should adapt to conditions. Anything less than perfect (and that is a personal preference) then one or two more influential individuals can sway things for a who.e team. However if they know that they are not going to get paid they may consider the options. Maybe the pay structure is wrong but with a crap season, poor fixtures fans drifting away in droves you would think that some riders who apparently depend on a living from speedway might think of the bigger picture. Let’s see how many clubs survive into 2019 with whatever daft revamp the BSPA have come up with. The powers that be have lost the plot and the riders think they are bigger than the sport itself. Both deserve each other but few deserve the loyal support of the fans

And doing nothing panders to those riders who hold everyone to ransom. Years back this would rarely have happened and the riders would have respect for the fans for giving it a go. Now it is two fingers to everyone. Furthermore if a clubs financial position is that precarious that any form of protest is going to bring it to its knees, the so beit but blame the instigators who are those riders whose refusal to get a meeting on is seriously taking the whole issue to another level. With these amateurs the sport is beyond redemption and these riders are almost asking to be out of work. They fail to look at the bigger picture and if they cannot hack it do something different but don’t take the p... out of the supporters

What is going to get through to these so called riders. The fans have had enough and if these riders cannot control a bike in various conditions thrown at them then give up and find another way of earning a living. No respect, for those who are bringing the sport to its knees. Riders, promoters (with few exceptions) deserve each other. Soon you will be racing in front of no one having pissed off the loyal fans who foolishly stuck with it for far too long. To the riders and promoters I say you all owe the fans big time.

Another nail in the coffin of speedway. CL has been a rider who you have the utmost respect and today’s clan of whimps should learn a thing or two about adapting to conditions and giving it a try. If after a few heats the track does not improve then fine but frankly what you have now is the equivalent of fine weather fishermen. Time the fans boycotted meetings to show they have had enough. Today’s riders are so far removed from being men with skills and track craft that frankly they are killing off the sport @nd deserve to be out of work.

These were just five fixtures in the Premiership from the 8th August to Monday 13th 8th - Kings Lynn v Belle Vue / Swindon v Leicester 9th - Poole v Leicester 13th - Leicester v Belle Vue / Poole v Somerset And yet Still outstanding from A fixtures based on SS are the following KL v Leicester / KL v Wolverhampton / Swindon v Belle Vue The B fixtures still to be run Belle Vue have five fixture (after taking into account Somerset yesterday) ( 3 home 2 away) KL have six (3 home and 3 away) Leicester have four (2 home and 2 away) Poole have six (3 home and 3 away) Somerset have seven (4 home 3 away) Swindon have three (2 home 1 away) Wolverhampton have seven (3 home 4 away) You have to question why by the third week of August so many fixtures are still to be run when there have been so many blank dates throughout most weeks since May and with some A fixtures still to be completed, it is a farce. Set cut off dates and that is it. The clubs really need to organise themselves better.

While we still have no news, an interesting comment in SS this week by Stuart Kellie of Plymouth when he is quoted as saying “We have an idea of how speedway will run in 2019 and it is just a case of forecasting how we can balance the figures, taking into account the potential gate figures and sponsorship income” This was said as Plymouth are considering stepping up from the NL. I guess all will be revealed in the fullness of time but if Plymouth have an idea why can’t the BSPA be more open and in doing so perhaps generate some good will from one of their most important assets, the supporters. I suspect I know the answer and in the end their approach to public relations continue to be dire.

It might be good for the sport providing the punters turn up. Too many promoters looking after number one and the lack of cooperation is evident. Also give a thought to those fans who have lost money on hotels and booked holidays around fixtures only to find them changed at the last minute (not because of weather) without a second thought by the promoters. All have had adequate time to get their house in order and most have failed miserably. If it down to overseas commitments, that is another issue that needs to dealt with, if it is the double up then that confirms FRN etc. Is not working. No extension is the fairest way. What happens if they did and it peed down that week. Another extension?

I do not think you are alone. I long gave up on six man teams made up of guests, strays and anyone who could ride a bike and the fact that the powers that be felt I only needed to watch speedway every two or three weeks has been the final straw and my response is well screw you lot. I will save the cash and find something more interesting to follow. Too many of the people running clubs are so far removed from reality that they really need to get out and do everyone a favour and take up knitting because they are of no value to the well being of speedway

I don’t think it is just a case that the standard of rider that has dropped. You do not have to have Gregg, Tai and others to make a good race, but you do want to see riders with track craft, throttle control and the ability to adapt to the track as presented and put on a show. Fans are fed up with seeing those that work at it to hone their skills versus those who ride in so many leagues and countries that Speedway U.K. is just pin money. The paying public deserve better. Aim for a level playing field and that does not mean clubs wasting money they do not have on the top stars because the UK version of speedway cannot afford them any longer. Speedway is a spent sport that will struggle for years to come so it is time to wise up and run at a level that can be reasonably funded out of the very little revenue that each team can generate. Those that cannot make ends meet should close. It needs to be a part time income for those riding over here not the sole source of pay for the participants. Why supporters want to watch six riders plus R/R every other week really makes no sense. Being weekly is probably more a case of if you are lucky (more like,ly every three to four weeks) and with no real allegiance to the team because of guests and double ups supporters no longer recognise or have a local team. You have a bunch of riders who are mercenaries and take what they can get from any source. They are not interested in the punter just the pound in their pocket from the nights racing be this a fixed fee and/or points money.

Just thought that local charities might create more publicity and bring in that local support which is there or thereabouts and raise the profile in the local community. National publicity has not worked and the lazy promoters do not sell the sport relying on press and radio coverage (mainly BBC) so this is partly doing the job for them. We know that promoters rarely promote (unlike stock cars and bangers) and to keep the sport alive, something needs doing as without some ideas that are thinking outside the box speedway is dead in the water. Poor stadia, poor tracks, poor presentation and taking the p.. with running 15 races over two hours says all that is wrong. If you want to run something that takes two hours plus then invoke some interest such as betting but stop taking the punters for fools. Promoters need to wise up and get real. If they cannot get a grip on what is wrong, close down the venue rather than hold others to ransom.

I agree and add to this the option of picking the finishing order and heat result. Betting stops as soon as the tapes rise. Alternatively run it like a lottery with a percentage of the wager going to to a local charity each week and for the play offs a percentage goes to the Ben Fund. Put betting on site might see the numbers through the gate increase. Some comparison with dog betting but less time to wait between races.

It does seem that some of the debate revolves around the fans/supporters. Older fans were brought up on a diet of mixed racing, league, cup, individual meetings 4TT etc and enjoyed the weekly fix which also achieved the desired aim of riders in having more track time. Today many will not turn up / support anything other than league meetings. That is fine and a choice we all make However with fewer clubs not always having their preferred choice of racing night and having to fight over a dwindling pool of riders given the pull of European clubs, it does make it difficult to get a settled 1 to 7 in any BL club with regular weekly racing particular when the customer base only want one form of meeting and will not turn out in decent enough numbers to support/following speedway racing except a league meeting. Up and coming riders have little chance of breaking in when the track time is so scarce. Perhaps the decline is not just due to the product and all the associated issues, it may well be that the punter has played a major part in the decline with their choices. Other theories will do the rounds as to who or what is wrong and lots of ideas on here have merit but perhaps the supporters need to look inwardly and think would I run a speedway team with such a fickle client base.