norbold

Tyburn Gallows was his real name.....eventually. He changed his name by deed poll.

Tyburn Gallows, even if he was a complete nutcase!

Is Tom Farndon the same as Tom Fardon though?

Ivor Brown averaged 10.00 in 1965; 7.9 in 1966 and 7.5 in 1967.

Not sure why this is under Wembley, but I remember that meeting well. Won by Jack Young who showed how he must have been 10 years earlier when he was arguably the greatest rider in the world. Still got my programme.

His accident was in 1973 at Coventry. He suffered brain damage and never really recovered. Les was one of the few riders to ride for one team all his career.

I think there is no doubt he would have qualified in the three (four including 1939) pre-War years injuries permitting. He would have been 36 in 1946, the same age as Vic Duggan and five years younger than Jack Parker. Good call about Max Grosskreutz, LS.

Tom Farndon....or doesn't it count if they died before the World Championship was introduced?

I would certainly go along with Vic Duggan as the greatest rider not to win the World Championship. Others would be Jack Parker, Graham Warren, Split Waterman, Aub Lawson, Brian Crutcher, Gote Nordin, Igor Plechanov, Dave Jessup and Leigh Adams.

I bought a copy of Speedway World at the first meeting I ever went to. Its front page headline was "Brian Crutcher Retires", so I never got to see him ride! I think though there is no doubt he should be in a top 30 British riders of all-time. As you say yourself, Sidney, for a while he was the equal of the likes of Fundin, Briggs and Moore and he was a well-known name in an era when speedway received a bit more publicity in the papers than it does now. On the other hand I saw Ron How many times and thought he was always a bit underrated because he was second to Ronnie Moore but he was an essential part of the all-conquering Wimbledon team of the late 50s and early 60s. He was a world finalist eight times and between 1958 and 1964 averaged over nine points per match every season. Between 1958 and 1965 he was ranked in the Top 20 riders in the world in the Speedway Star ranking lists, generally around mid way. Without listing the other top British riders, I think I would have him in my top 30.

Yes, I must admit I overlooked Jack Biggs! I probably would put him in instead of Norman Hunter.

All time Hackney team under CHR's original stipulation of all-time career: Heat Leaders: Vic Duggan, Mark Loram , Cordy Milne Second Strings: Bengt Jansson, Malcolm Simmons, Zenon Plech Reserves: Chris Louis, Norman Hunter

Wot! No Savalas Clouting?

Just heard some very sad news that prolific speedway journalist and historian and my old friend, John Chaplin, has died. R.I.P., John.

That's funny, he lived near me too, in Clacton. I met him a few times, but never thought to ask him his real name!

I always found Norman a good name for a Speedway Rider. It's an especially good one to name your children after!

....or Knutson

Yes, maybe, and it was the question I raised about Split Waterman at New Cross. But as CHR originated the thread and it's his idea that it's "all-time" not just club, I would have thought that we should abide by his wishes and his rules.

Apparently not, according to the originator of the thread. See above.

Thanks CHR. If it's over their whole career, then: Heat Leaders: Tom Farndon, Barry Briggs, Jack Milne Second Strings: Split Waterman, Lionel Van Praag, Ron Johnson Reserves: Cyril Roger, Eric Williams

I think CHR meant the eight greatest of all time and then grade them as if they were in one team together. The point you make about Banger is what I meant and I agree. Malcolm Simmons started out as a reserve but worked his way up to heat leader with West Ham, but his best days came after he left the Hammers, so he is another in the Split/Banger category. Lofqvist was always a heat leader.

The problem I have with this is, do you mean when they were actually riding for the club, or over their whole career? My best example of this would be Split Waterman. If it was over his whole career he would certainly make my New Cross team, but if we are just talking about the period he was actually at New Cross, probably not.

Yes.

Technically, he was the best rider I ever saw. He could do anything on a bike! I think the only thing he lacked that prevented him from winning more World titles was that ruthless killer instinct as typified by riders like Fundin, Briggs, Mauger and Rickardsson. He was too much of a gentleman! And he always put his team first before his own individual ambitions. Although, as I said, he was the "enemy", being the star of our closest rivals, I really came to admire him over the years.

Yes, sadly, he was very good at New Cross. Wimbledon being our local rivals and all! But then he was good everywhere!