mikebv

Adrian Smith does the same at BV.. Not just around the 'posh seats' either he ventures over to us great unwashed on the South Stand....

One of the main issues the Sport has is that often the Promoters appear not actually bothered whether a profit is made or not, and its ran for a fair few as an expensive hobby which other parts of their income can afford to subsidise. That can never help move the Sport forward as there is no organic growth, no vision to better itself year on year. . Matt Ford seems to come in for much criticism but as far as I know Poole Speedway is his main income therefore he runs it like a business. Not spending more than he budgets for, speculating to accumulate and replacing riders who fail to deliver success.. For many in the Sport it appears to be a chance to become a 'Lord of a fiefdom' (ignoring how miniscule the 'fiefdom' actually is), when maybe in their normal business life they are just another statistic.. It seems running a business in the real world is somewhat different to running Speedway as so many seem to circumnavigate normal business practice as soon as they put that 'Promoters hat' on.. I hope the CEO at Belle Vue, Adrian Smith, doesn't find himself succumbing to the "ahh, but this is Speedway" nonsense that gets rolled out time and time again to explain/defend the latest ridiculous decree, and can use his expertise to influence the Sport going forwards.. 'Outsiders' though have sometimes appeared better welcomed in 'Royston Vasey' than in British Speedway through the years....

I think the new competition is being set up to help grow the Sport in nations that currently have Speedway but not much chance of ever reaching the SWC final, whilst maybe trying to reduce Poland's huge strength in depth advantage to make the competition less predictable.. For me, a shame the SWC is being changed as it provides the best racing of the year, however I can see the logic of trying to develop the Sport in other nations. And having a 'team' wearing your nations flag in a World Final may help generate interest in these countries....

And the Sport when riders were household names in the Seventies due to TV coverage regularly on World Of Sport, played on their individual (and International Team success) rather than the domestic team they rode for.. Whether Belle Vue did well or not was irrelevant to the overall success of the Sport in comparison to what Peter Collins did on ITV on regular Saturdays during the Summer in European, Intercontinental and World Finals, (and the WTC too).. Nowadays of course the 'team dynamic' is nothing sadly but a pale imitation of what it once was, unfortunately we don't have a great 'Team GB' to get a nation interested, nor do we have the free to air terrestrial TV coverage to bring the likes of Woffy to a wider audience..

The big plus of targeting kids is simply their parents take them and pay to get in.. Kiddie pressure to go somewhere they like is something I and millions of others know only too well to our (literally) cost......!! There is only so much disposable income a family has for 'entertainment' so very often 'the kids' will dictate the place to visit... Obviously you would want to target all demographics to attend the Sport but targeting kids would I would suggest bring the biggest and fastest return on your investment... Look at Mcdonald's and Burger King, they have two very different customer profiles and advertise themselves accordingly. McDonald's target the kids through parties as well as advertising (at great length and cost), how '100% natural chicken breast' their nuggets are, and Burger King target the adult market through pushing 'taste' , 'quality', and 'size' of Burgers (eg flame grilled Whopper etc)... Now look at the huge disparate success of each business.... I would suggest Mcdonald's know which demographic makes them the most money and targets them accordingly... What Speedway does miss for me is the huge opportunities that treating EVERY meeting as an EVENT would bring. For many tracks 500 more punters a night would see them in profit... To do that you don't need the same 500, any random 500 each week will do... If some stay and become regulars then great, if not there is a huge catchment area of thousands around most tracks that have never even heard of the Sport on their doorstep.. Don't spend £3000 a match on a No1 who whether there or not hardly has any impact to the crowd level as the locals 'wouldnt know him from Adam', instead spend half that a week employing someone who can get the locals into the stadiums!!

Great posts Barry, Looks like you tick a lot of boxes when it comes to customer care and knowing what they want.. About, what seems, 100 years ago now I got a degree in tourism marketing, focusing on the Leisure industry, ie hotels, museums, musicals, shows, gardens, stately homes, fun parks, water parks etc etc,. A highly competitive area where each fight against each other for the 'entertainment doller' of their customers.. I was very fortunate in that the lecturer I had had retired at 45, a very wealthy man who had spent his adult life working successfully within, and then advising many major 'Leisure' oriented businesses on how to be successful and used his lecturing as an opportunity to share his knowledge for, as he described it, "his beer money"... He always made a point of differentiating between price and value for money as the key determinant of what people purchase. With price often the short term reason and value for money the long term reason for repeat purchases.. He mentioned often how important effective communication was in relation to customers and how repeat visits were key to the continued growth of any business, but particularly in the Leisure/Entertainment sector. He advised all his clients to have a database of their customers, which in those days amounted to telephone numbers and addresses as a basic, and birthdays, anniversaries, kids names and their birthdays in particular, as an add on 'to make the difference'. He even used to make notes on each family who attended his hotel, ie if they ever mentioned any 'memorable occasions coming up' he wrote it down on their booking forms so when they returned the following year one of the first things he asked was for example 'how did little Johnny do when he went for his 'tying a knot badge' at cubs?" A very, very powerful tool in winning the emotional loyalty of your customers, all within seconds of them visiting your establishment.. He also sent out through the year Xmas cards, Anniversary cards, Birthday cards (with small gifts for the kids) as one of his key messages was 'always make sure they remember you even through the off season'.. Now meeting and greeting every fan at Speedway would be unrealistic but targeting the kids as so few attend at many tracks would be possible. As would, in this modern age, getting email, and mobile phone data of every adult in attendance to target market them through the season and off season. Eg How many clubs push their mechandise at Xmas to their fanbase? Maybe an odd 10% off voucher sent electronically would get them interested? How many clubs know who has actually attended the match every week? In this digital age it wouldn't be difficult to know and then target anyone missing a few weeks with direct marketing.. His final two bits of advice was 'never be afraid to know the truth' and by that he encouraged all his businesses to 'pro-actively' seek feedback, as what you think you may be providing is sometimes very differently perceived by your customers, and always make sure customers went away with either a positive memory or a tangible souvenir (preferably both!) to remind them of their visit.. First and last impressions are so very, very important.... As someone who was a 1970's follower of the Sport so saw the 'great days' of Collins, Mauger, Olsen et al, I have to say that today's racing is, in the main, often of a not too dissimilar standard to what I witnessed back then (and at the NSS I see some of the best racing I have ever seen in over 40 years of watching the Sport ). So from a racing perspective I would suggest that the 'core product' is more than acceptable. The biggest difference is nowadays you often watch 'contrived meetings' full of Guests, in three quarters empty stadia rather than packed in on the terraces watching 'your team' like we did, in the main, during the Sports 'halcyon' days... A BIG crowd can certainly make an 'ordinary' meeting 'special' and vice versa, a poor crowd can make a 'great' meeting appear no more than 'ordinary'... It seems on the Isle Of White at least you are trying to bring that BIG crowd in to deliver that virtuous circle Speedway so desperately needs of.. Big crowd = More Atmosphere. More Atmosphere = More Customer Satisfaction. More Customer Satisfaction = Bigger Crowds... And delivering it too through some clear, modern thinking, pro active marketing allied to a customer focused operating model,... So more power to your elbow Barry and Team down there. .! Hope it continues to be a success, and maybe a Blueprint for others...?

I would suggest this scoring system would be used if one of the aims is to make 'lesser countries' more competitive, even more so if another aim is to help grow the sport in these countries.. USA, Slovenia, Slovakia, Latvia, and Germany all have at least one rider who can win races at the top level, meaning they all should be competitive using this system.. (If Greg bothers to ride obviously!)

Course they would.. Every teen wants a night out once a week socialising with their Dad and Granddad! Don't they?

Could be a good deterrent that.. "Commit a crime young man and you will spend the next 6 months going to Speedway"

Just a thought re Promotion of the Sport without any need to pay any money out to a pro media company.. I would suggest circa £15k a night is the ball park figure (maybe more?) for both teams salaries collectively per meeting. .. If so, why not make that £15k the 'Prize' on offer?... It could be split £10k to the winners £5k to the losers. It might mean less riders per team for them to ride for the money but that would create much needed rider supply.. Plus points would be... It would give the Competition some 'kudos' which it so badly lacks at present.. EVERY meeting would have something riding on it which often isn't the case now we have the play offs... Riders dropping their averages would lose cash as well as lose their team mates money.. No riders could 'go through the motions' as they could earn double with a victory, as it would be basically performance related pay... To be succesful you would have to have individuals working as a team committed to the cause rather than treating it like a 'stop off' on a weekly European sojourn.. Crowds could stay behind and watch a 'proper presentation' at the end of every meeting, interviews with riders, photos taken with big cheques in front of those boards you see in other sports with the Sponsors names on them etc etc Given there are 118 meetings in the Premiership, you could then sell the Sport along the lines of "The Speedway Premiership is this year worth over One and Three Quarter Million Pounds to the Eight Teams competing". Maybe even add in the extra £30k collectively to take it to £1.8M? (Actual total would be £1,770M).. Obviously clubs would agree how the money is shared around their riders from No1 downwards but if you ran with five or six man teams each would get a good few quid even in defeat.. Selling the sport using those sort of numbers must generate some outside response and interest if nothing else..? All of a sudden it doesn't appear as 'small time and irrelevant' as it looks today... People are like sheep and will follow the latest fad or trend because for so many, "if it's sounds succesful, it MUST be succesful".. To afford it and pay the vat at £15 a head you would need 1200 a night. Obviously there are other costs on top to pay for each meeting but maybe that's where Sponsors come in? And maybe more hype will bring more Sponsors in wanting to be associated with the Sport? Tracks that weekly average around 1000 - 1200 now for often 'Mickey Mouse' meetings must increase their regulars count surely if EVERY match had something tangible riding on it? Teams pay out vast sums already in pay, so they might as well use that same cash to enhance the Profile of the Sport through a bit of 'style over substance' marketing which so many very successful businesses use...

1. Marketing/Hype. - No marketing of the Sport nationally yet millions paid out to riders who patently didn't maintain the crowds interest or numbers. Look what Barry Hearn has done with darts? Look at how the PDC is marketed v the 'other' organisation the BDO? Its the same game! But that is where the similarity ends. Hearn marketed the Sport, and the players incrementally earned more as the Sport grew organically. He didnt pay out huge money before he had it coming in! In 1993 the Winner of the World Title earned £64k. This time he will get £440k.. One is loud, brash, colourful and very, very succesful. The other tries to match it (badly) and tries to be all things to all men from grass roots to World Champions.. British Speedway is the BDO to Poland's PDC, stuck in a time warp of a by-gone era which has no linkage to today's society.. 2. Attendances - Not spotting that an ever growing older demographic was your only dwindling customer base. (Just like Woolworths, and we know how that went). And even if they did spot it, doing absolutely nothing nationally as a colllective about it (see point one)... 3. Credibilty. - planning fixtures to suit riders needs rather than the requirements of the fans. Resulting in disjointed schedules, and a plethora of 'Mickey Mouse' meetings, full of guests, which render the whole competition a waste of time and loses any emotional involvement a fan should have following 'their team'. And if a competition is a 'waste of time with no credibilty', simply "why go to watch it?" 4. Admission Costs. - Maybe due to costs they cannot be lower? But quite simply, you will not attract a regular crowd every week/fortnight/tri-weekly/every fourth Wednesday if the dogs isn't on and we can get Greg over (delete as applicable). There has to be a way of reducing entrance fees. We who are left are used to paying inflation busting admission fees, now circa £18, but any newbies (which the Sport so desperately needs) will be very reluctant to dip their toe in the Speedway water at those prices. Remember, most won't have a clue about the Sport other than via TV or YouTube. Forking out £50 or so for a family not knowing beforehand if they will enjoy it or not is a big ask I would suggest. And one not too many will take.. 5. Integrity - Far too many rules and regulations mean the more switched on will invariably find loopholes to gain an advantage. All this does is frustrate fans of other clubs who either follow the rules honestly (or maybe are not savvy enough to do the same?). Assessed averages based on performances from previous years? He can ride in that division on an 8.00 average/But Him on a 6.50 cannot? He is Swedish, but blonde, but also left handed, so is a 5.00 not a 6.00? etc etc just paints the Sport as an insular nonsense. Self policing is often no policing and as long as those who make decisions have a vested interest in that particular decision, there will always be suspicions of things being contrived and manipulated. Not a great way to encourage fans to 'buy in' to your Sport with emotion (and cash).. 6. It's Not Just The Speedway - As years go by and times change, people want more from a night out. Except in Speedway where the policy seems to be 'if it was good enough for Great Uncle Jack, it's good enough for them today'! Many it appears, simply opens the gates and expect thousands to flock in. It's the same tired old routine at so many tracks with absolutely zero extra to enhance the evenings experience. People want more bang for their buck these days! Speedway's well meaning amateurs unfortunately are not equipped with the relevant skill set to deliver it.. In Summary TMC. For me there are far too many self inflicted wounds compounded by a complete lack of vision and adaptability over the years to turn the Sport around. It is crying out for modern thinking, dynamic and clear leadership from someone who understands marketing and customer needs and wants. Always struck me as odd that as 'Rome has burned around them' the 'Nero's' who have run the Sport have paid over the past 20 years literally tens and tens of millions out to riders, who by their presence havent even maintained crowd levels never mind increased them, yet haven't paid a penny to any professional marketing company who maybe could have hyped the Sport enough to get it on the wider community radar... An incredible business plan..

You do have to laugh a little bit when you read the nonsense often written about GB kids as they come through.. I was lucky enough to watch Joe Screen make his debut and the subsequent next few years where as a 16 -19 year old he rode against, and often beat, the very best riders in the World, who at the time remember, all rode in Britain every week. . Joe went on to reach Number Six in the World. No mean achievement but not 'World Beating'.. Nowadays some 16 year old kid who can ride well in the NL and hold down a place at reserve or at best second string in the lowest ever standard Championship and Premiership is considered by some a potential world beater... The reality is somewhat different..

Steradent...☺

Best Wishes Starman...

The team doesn't look to be a great one but don't forget in Speedway, given the nature of the play offs... "it's not the team you start the season with but the one you finish it with" that really counts.. Who knows? Maybe the rules re 8pt riders change during the season and you could see Lindgren back replacing one of the middle order should the team average drop sufficiently to accomodate him? I think we as fans put too much focus and almost forensic dissection on the pre season team building when often it appears as nothing more than a tactical 'means to an end'..

Or have more riders vying for their position...? Far too easy to get a job for a season in Speedway regardless of performance due to not enough competition for places. . First though you would have to get rid of the situation where you know your average maybe too high to get you a job the following year, cannot blame riders for not scoring in the short term to ensure they earn in the long term..

The three league system should be aspirational... One rider riding at No1 in two seperate levels is ludicrous... NL should be for development for riders who are dreaming of becoming a Speedway rider and old hands wanting to keep having fun on a bike a couple of times a week. Payment? Expenses only covering maybe travel, and machine fuel... Championship should be semi pro, for riders too good for NL and now dreaming of making a full time living out of the Sport, and ex top division old hands who still want to earn money out of the sport but dont want to commit full time to it anymore. Income supplemented by a full or part time job or if wanting to move up the ladder then a sponsor supports them or simply 'tough it out to deliver their dream' like so many other Sports' competitors do.. Premiership should be for full time, international level riders (or max a rung or two below that level). Riders who truly are 'Professional Speedway Riders' travelling the globe for their money. Put five man teams in at Prem and Champ level like Denmark and six man teams at NL level.. Salary cap of £7000 a night at Prem level depending on position in team, £1800, £1600, £1400, £1200 £1000. £2500 a night at Champ level. £700, £600, £500, £400, £300... £600 a night max expenses paid between six riders in the NL meaning £100 each.. Ride twice a week and a good few quid to be earned at Prem and Champ level, with less riders per team meaning competition for places and cover for injuries instead of guests.. With the next rung on the ladder meaning more money... As it should be...

Spot on.... Far too many times those in this Country who run the Sport have tried to put a sticking plaster on every cut that has been inflicted on it... A thousand cuts later has left it without any more plasters... It should have forged it's own identity (at whatever level that would be) and moved forward together as one entity, United in a shared vision for the common good.. Instead it faffed about constantly fudging and changing rules to try and maintain an ever dwindling top level rider interest, which ultimately ended up increasing admission costs to pay for them. And to help accomodate them, delivered disjointed fixture lists full of zero credibilty 'Mickey Mouse' meetings which simply lost the fans' interest.. These same fudged rule changes were then disected year after year by the more astute Promoters who saw loophole after loophole and used this to their advantage to 'put one over' their rivals, meaning fans became frustrated and disillusioned by their actions... It will take something (or someone) very special to get the sport succesful again such is the nonsense that has been allowed to go on for the past 20 years or so as Poland and the GP's have taken off.. Maybe finally it has been realised that a 'halfway house, all things to all men' approach doesn't work and British Speedway will (eventually) have its own clearly mapped out business plan and operating model? Which every team buys into, realising that the collective has to succeed rather than one or two individual tracks? If so, better late than never... But the plan needs to be very, very good to make any difference..

Belle Vue, Birmingham, Bradford, Leicester, Wolverhampton, Coventry... So many tracks within towns or cities with a high ethnic, in particular Asian, populous in and around the tracks immediate catchment area.. Nothing seems to be done to attract this ever growing sector of the community to the Speedway on their doorstep... A huge opportunity I would suggest in targeting them, particularly as many of whom in this community have a culturally higher than average number of children...

Contempt for OAP's? I hope to retire in five years so why would I have contempt for them? As for expecting you to subsidise my lad, of course he is my responsibility and I pay for his attendance, but the point I was making was that Speedway would be far better letting all kids in for free and budgeting all adult prices accordingly to pay for this to happen.... No point cutting prices for your regulars (whatever their age) when you are not attracting enough new customers, and new customers who can get their kids in for free are much more likely to keep attending and become regulars.. If you reach 65 and haven't attended or are not a regular at Speedway I don't think saving £3 off admission will suddenly make you a 'die hard', whereas getting some teenager interested by letting them in for nothing may reap dividends later when they are adults... Logistically a teenager who becomes interested in Speedway could over the next sixty years spend a lot of money on the Sport.. That's the market Speedway needs to attract and incentivise..

If it's a "small gain" for the promotion then surely its a "small loss" to the person concerned.. £3 has been mentioned? If £3 makes the difference between going or not I would suggest those effected would be better off not going at all as its pretty much a 'breadline' existence they are experiencing... And if anyone suffering that 'lifestyle' is so passionate about their Speedway that they must attend every week then I am sure they will ensure they save their three quid elsewhere .. I think given the response from several OAP's it appears more about them having an unjustified 'sense of entitlement'... Just waiting for "I didn't fight jerry for this" to be included...😲

Course my lad is my responsibility.. However what isn't my responsibility is subsidising the concession fee for OAP's through my own admission fee, the level of which tracks will have set to deliver the overall projected return from all demographics..

My son is 14 years old... So obviously doesn't work... He has been watching the Aces regularly since he was 3 years old... How did the Aces reward him for his loyalty? They charged him £8 when he got to 12 years of age.. How does he pay this? He earns no money... However when he gets to 65 he will have hopefully had circa 45 years of earnings behind him to enable him to pay 'full whack' at the Speedway should he still be interested (and presuming the Sport still exists in Britain) Maybe for the future of the Sport under 16's (at least) should be free, subsidised by no concessions for grown men and women...?

When they become 'assets' do riders get a 'signing on fee'? If so, maybe not wanting to pay that back means they stay as an 'asset' for teams that they will never ride for?

The GP deal will be separate... Nothing to do with the BSPA...