mikebv

And what they fail to grasp is that the '70's model' didn't bring the many tens of thousands into the stadiums anyway.... What did that was watching truly world class riders on ITV on Saturday afternoons when the choice of viewing was pretty much Grandstand or World Of Sport (and Open University Maths on BBC2...).. Watching the best in the world ride in 'proper competitions' sponsored by nationally renowned companies, who put up BIG prizes, (which meant no one ducked out on the day with sick notes written by Dr's Zhivago and Dolittle), would have enthused thousands to watch riders who were very much "household names" amongst the wider sport watching public.. The sport still runs the same outdated operating model today, but nowadays without that "world class advert" on terrestrial TV to feed off the back of... And of course you also now have the internet which splashes all the nonsense out there for everyone to see well before meeting time, which then means fans can avoid paying to watch some of the farces that are allowed to pervade. In the 70's you were already in, and money banked, before you found out the top star was missing... Oh how the current promoters must be so envious of their 70's counterparts..

It will never catch on.... All that entertainment malarkey...

A Speedway promoter reacting to feedback...? And taking it as constructive comment, and not defensively? And using it to improve his operation rather than decide "I am right' and ignore the feedback? Are you sure you are cut out for this Barry?

Given how many times he guests, Scott will be coming to a track near absolutely everyone sometime soon I am sure..

100%.. Exactly the same way as the promotional plan should be one that is nationally targeted advertising the whole sport in the UK, not individual clubs doing their own thing for very minimal impact..

When those who pay their money (and regularly too), take the piss, it really cannot end well can it? Championship riders @ Premiership prices wont ever be a 'winner'will it?

Truly wasting your time my friend... This feedback could be replicated ten thousand (at least) fold... No one is listening "I need to find a guest as my rider is injured for my team but not his other one".. "Who rides my track well and I can use that 5% above the average of my injured rider the best?" Utter. Utter. Bollocks.. But seems to make sense to those who run the sport.. . "Roll up. Roll up. Form and orderly queue and give us your money".. "You should be f***ing grateful us promoters do this"...

Must confess I have never understood the "use it or lose it" ultimatum often quoted by fans, (and indeed some promoters), down the years... By the very definition such utterances are used suggests that those who are "expected to go" (and therefore regarded as 'loyal fans'), are actually simply "not bothered" whether the clubs carry on or not.. Because if it did mean so much to them, they would still be attending in sufficient numbers to not require those very comments in the first place.. A demise of a club is sad, but often inevitable, as the 'tipping point' is finally reached re costs v income after several weeks of struggle, and the difference between the two finally becomes untenable to be bridged by the promoter... And as the reasons for that demise often lies within the operating model of the sport, and is therefore self inflicted, it seems to prove that (contrary to popular belief), turkey's do seem to vote for xmas after all it would appear.. Promoters often do seem to sometimes over estimate how 'important' a Speedway club is to its followers and make the mistake of believing it means 'everything' to them similar to all other team sports.. However, by it's very operating model, the sport doesn't engender that blind loyalty, devotion and tribalism that other team sports do, therefore it simpy cannot mean the same emotionally... Which ultimately is the 'acid test' of any team sports' sustainability and progression I would suggest..

Let's be brutally honest.. These clubs are only in existence to provide riders with rides... Meaning they ride for all and sundry on as many nights as they can... Bottom line is it doesn't really matter who wins any UK meeting, meaning it also doesnt really matter who wins any UK league.. Therefore expecting people to "buy in to it", and take it seriously as a team sport is a huge ask I would say, and you cannot envy any promoters trying to go out and "sell it"... As tracks close it will find its natural level and those that can still generate a "decent crowd" will prosper (as much as you can in UK speedway), and those that can't will go by the wayside.. Having been to Brum a couple of times it must be a difficult place to try and sell Speedway. At 50 something I always felt "very young" when surrounded by a large amount of Brum fans , and city centre tracks within large conurbations, eg Manchester, Birmingham, Newcastle, all seem to attract very, very few of the millions who live virtually on their doorstep.. And teenage kids simply wont be seen anywhere where their father attends (and in many cases their grandad).. You can only flog a dead horse so many times until you realise that to keep throwing money at something, that has a tiny chance of gaining any return, is completely futile.. I do admire promoters who are willing to put their own money into the sport, but also am then equally as amazed that they then allow themselves to run it the way they do... Speedway's very own version of Hari Kari... (And that isnt a 4 point Japanese international that could be worth a punt)..

My son in law said that he wants to go again and said "I think I could get into this more when I understand the rules"... I quickly explained to him that Steve Worrall (who took his eye as "being good"), was Belle Vue's captain, Rory Schlein is Leicester's Nick Morris and Ryan Douglas' team mate at Wolves, and that Schlein will rode for Ipswich tonight because one of their riders is injured.. I then told him that Kyle Howarth rides for Sheffield, Hans Anderson rides for Peterborough and Danny King rides for Ipswich... As his eyes glazed over whilst taking it all in I just said.. "Best bet Jake, is to very much NOT bother trying to understand the rules and just enjoy the racing"... Taking him to watch Ipswich at the NSS next week...

I mentioned on the Poole v Leicester thread.. £27 quid for me and my 18 year old student lad last night. .. If I went with my wife the two of us would have paid £34 which I would have regarded as "too much" for what is on offer to be honest.. To stand at the NSS now it's "all open" again, two adults costs £40 which isnt value for money in my opinion, especially to watch mainly the same riders in the top division that you see in the second... That £25 to £30 price point that I paid last night for two "adults" seems around "THE' price point for any Speedway in the UK I would say... And ride on the night you can get your best crowd in... Looking at Poole's attendance last night, traditional Wednesday night racing brought them a couple of thousand or so I would suggest... From a business model perspective they race on their best night to get a crowd, presumably pay out less for 2nd Division pay scales, and can charge their fans a few quid less than they would need to, to pay 1st Div money out.... A fair few boxes ticked last night by Poole I would think...

Enjoyed that tonight.. Seemed to be a bit of thought gone in to the introductions and the music too.. With the proof being my 18 year lad and 23 year old son in law (first time attendee to speedway), actually recognised some of the songs One noticeable thing for me though was the fact I paid £27 for me and my student lad and watched pretty much the same riders that I paid £44 to watch a couple of weeks ago.. (No student concession) at the NSS in a top league encounter.. ie Schlein, Douglas, Morris and Worrall.. Much better VFM it seems in the Championship.. Add in Danny King, Hans Anderson and Kyle Howarth and you do have to question the top leagues prices for all intent and purpose the 'same thing'.. Racing was 'ok' with a few decent passes and several close races which kept you interested to the end.. Poole just too good for the Lions to make it a 'classic'... Seemed a decent crowd too with a bit of atmosphere getting generated in the main stand.. Son in law has said he wants to go again so taking him to the NSS when we get back of hols...

Well it is 2021..... Thanks for the info. .. Now to find a cash point.....

Especially given its a "holiday resort" area too Lisa... Plenty of speedway fans currently within a couple of hours travel I would think that may fancy a trip that they wouldn't take if at home several hundred miles away... Personally don't use twitter but do use official websites as they should always be up to date and accurate... Looking at quite a few websites some appear a fair few weeks out of date... Making our way over this afternoon and looking forward to a good night's entertainment... Come on you Pirons, or is it Liates....?

Thanks Lisa... Need to update their website then... A BIG selling point is PATG and No Masks anymore I would think to many. .. And that goes for all tracks...

Exactly Ian... Hype can go a long way in getting an audience, even when it's 'economical with the truth'... I have always thought that each meeting should be regarded as "stand alone" and sold separately using various "high impact" promotional tools... Twenty or so meetings a year, using twenty or so definitive "pushes"... Let's be honest just an extra 500 at most tracks would be "game changing" and it doesn't need the same 500 each week, it could be 500 completely different people (although hopefully you would want to get some regulars)... Eg 2.5 million people live within the Gtr Manchester conurbation, all within 45 mins of a superbly appointed (and shaped) city centre track and modern stadium, with excellent motorway linkage.. Surely a high impact promotional strategy should get 500 a week extra to attend, even if just through curiosity based on the promotional activity?

Tried to find a tel number for them to ask the question if we could get a refund, as website didn't say, and given Speedway's penchant for "no refunds" I thought I would check... Five of us going was circa £150 with entrance and food so wasn't going to take a risk of "sorry mate"...

Cheers Steve, just been on the website and it says advance tickets, wear masks all the time etc within the code of conduct... Take it that's no longer the case given lockdown easing..?

I think the term 'promoter' doesn't always help them... They are in most cases just an owner of a speedway licence to run the sport.... Calling them 'promoters' bring connotations of someone actually going out and actively selling a product within the entertainment industry, or promoting sports built on hype like boxing.... So many of these owners simply have zero skill set in doing something similar. .. Maybe they should just drop the name.. No other sports teams have "promoters", instead have "owners", "chairpersons" and "CEO's"....

Going along to this tonight, as staying in Devon... Is it pay at the gate? Didn't go to Plymouth last night as had to book in advance and if it had been called off then rain off tickets no good when back in Manchester from this Saturday. .

Pro rata to earnings not a million miles away from the UK, so it isnt "cheap", which is what is sometimes perceived over here.. However you do obviously get the worlds best for that pro rata amount rather than what we get over here.. The big money comes via the TV deals as the TV companies have to actually tender for the contracts, due to the popularity of the sport, which pushes the price they pay up.. This blanket TV and media coverage then attracts the big money sponsors who want to be associated with well known "national sport brands" as well as well known "national sporting celebrities"... Bottom line is.. If the Polish Leagues ever allowed Tai Woffinden to guest for Bartosz Zmarzlik, and Wroclaw didnt qualify for the play offs on the back of it, all TV and big name sponsors would simply walk away, as would the wider sports fans' interest... Run the sport Mickey Mouse and you reap what you sow and no amount of free tickets given away will keep an audience, (and expect them to pay), who can't emotionally buy in to what should be team sport tribalism... Hence Poland dont make the mistakes the UK have made and continue to make ad Infinitum..

And set yourself up with the previous comment too.. You not only headed it in, you crossed it yourself too... Well played....

Agree on all aspects... Playing a blame game is never a good response as a leadership team... As you say, given the team they have they are going to take a few 'beastings' so no need to give out apologies.. And as most riders get paid based on performance, I am sure it wasn't down to lack of effort. Lack of ability maybe, but any team who get beat by a superior one can testify to that... If it needed mentioning then it should have been a simple "We are all extremely disappointed but are all equally committed to turn it round".. And as you say, if you go public as a professional entity, for heaven's sake, get your message out using the correct English language, as it can come across as amateurish, and brand damaging, when you don't..

If another 'Woffy' came along and rode in the main body of the team, but was still an RS (like Anders Rowe), and ran say a 7 point average as he was so good... Could he then guest as a replacement for a 4* rider? Presume so given it appears your average 'doesn't matter' as was shown when Rowe recently guested for Bates..

Great meeting... Great atmosphere.... Away fans going mental and riders celebrating just as mentally with them... There really is no comparison from what you have in the UK is there? Apart from Jack Holder was riding obviously,.. Its exactly the same sport, but it isn't really is it? "Proper Speedway Nige"...