mikebv

They do form part of a forum though and I must admit do make me laugh now and again... But, in fairness to them, not as much as I laugh at those who rise to their bait and get themselves all worked up about something so insignificant.... And seem to react EVERY time....

And why not when rules allow them to do so? Makes total sense to me in a competition that doesnt take on any meaning (if any at all) until the back end of the season... Is it top six or four who qualify for the play offs? Either way, you would expect Poole to be in the play offs and enter them with a team that could quite conceivably win the final...

Takes me back to my accounting days..... Limited Liabilities... Nice...

However in Div 2 you can pay Div 1 standard heat leaders a "bit less" than their Div 1 counterparts, (but still a decent amount), whilst (unlike the Div 1 teams), pay the bottom end of the team money commensurate with their lower capability and lower standing in the sport.. Having three top heat leaders in a side is a no brainer (especially in a league with so much difference from top to bottom riders), as they will usually ride a minimum 14 times out of the 30 times a team races, meaning almost 50 percent of the meeting is covered by a "good heat leader".. At times riding together to possibly gain heat advantages, and at times preventing the other team getting heat advantages.. Meaning for most meetings they are always in with a shout.. For Poole, dropping down made perfect sense.. They could still ride Wednesdays and also afford to put out a very competitive team.. Which they rely on to keep their fanbase who have sometimes "walked" a little in seasons gone by when the team has nothing to ride for, with the drop more noticeable at Poole due to the very good crowd levels they usually generate when doing well.. The only down side to having teams like Poole in Div 2 is that "the have nots" stay as exactly that given the lack of talent to go round, and the league becomes too strong to be the bridge between Div 3 and Div 1, undermining progression as well as undermining the "top leagues" standing as the aspirational standard bearing "flagship" which any top league in any sport should be... Maybe three leagues of six would be a better way forward with the top two sharing most of the heat leaders and the bottom six teams all being allowed to put together competitive teams using Div 2 second strings, reserves, and NDL up and coming talent? With any clubs wanting to run a "second team" running in a seperate Div 4 development league...

Painted themselves into a corner haven't they? So not sure they can reduce their offer... Often using six Div 1 heat leaders per match rather than a couple at most with a mixture of riders of 2nd Div standard including two to four riders of Div 3 Heat Leader standard wishing to progress.. Instead we now have "Premier Light"...

Twenty years ago I would have been one of them... However, as usual, we had a fractured, halfway house, survival or the fittest/protect the weakest, muddled operating model with zero clear direction of where the sport was going, nor vision of what it was going to be... Nowadays you would have to think that having as many tracks (who are left), geographically around the country is 100% vital to at least try and keep some recognition of the sport by reasonably sized conurbations..

Div 2 teams being too strong is the biggest single issue for the sport for me... Should have had a points limit for top three riders in each team to share the heat leaders around.. Even if the teams with the most money then pay over the odds to bring a new high assessed rider in it would still have freed up heat leaders that they couldnt accommodate.. Given the disparity between top and bottom in each team in Div 2, it makes sense for teams with cash to spend big on heat leaders, as the bottom end of the team wont be of a level to demand too much I would think, and would be very interchangeable as the season goes on.. Will they ever truly see that working together to keep your weakest link strong enough to compete is the only way forward?

The losses could be even more if you "win"... And end up closing a track down.... Adrian Smith clearly has the support of those who pay the bills, and also, (from his interviews in the past), seems to understand what the sport needs to move forward, so would also be a loss to the sport overall... A tough year ahead maybe for the Aces, but crowds are very loyal there considering they had so many years of abject rubbish at the old track... Who knows, a few "cheap nights" salary wise and they could even make a profit... The irony of British Speedway....

2nd Division teams seem to do "ok" with 700 or so... And in Oxford's case you would like to think that the early meetings in particular will be a huge % amount higher than 700 given they are relaunching.. Lots of local publicity too initially, so hopefully these early crowds will help pay for a successful season overall as the crowd levels settle down and stabilise to its true level.. And even (if it is "just 700"), it's more than would be watching the sport if they hadn't have come back... 20 home matches or so and that is 14000 more clicks at the turnstiles for the sport..

They have had plenty of this over the years haven't they?... Bless them...

Careful now.. We don't want innovative Ideas.....

£8 for me in Birmingham...

Rider's Van's? If so, more points money needed...

Maybe it is "both"? ie you only lose what you planned (thus could afford) to do, by running a tight ship?

And that was back in the days of No1 riders running 11 point averages and teams having 2 point reserves... A huge gap between top and bottom, and even though BP's counted then, the No1's generally didn't pick many up.. Now we have No1's running less than 7.5 point averages and 4.5 point reserves so much closer in standard, meaning even less need to replace your No1 with a guest.. Just use a better RR system, which gives riders more chance to earn money and keeps the team ethos... And, more importantly, keeps the sport credible...

As mentioned.. Cut the number of riders per team and you have surplus... Lose a heat leader from every team for example... Those who only ride over here get to double up so have priority for a place, and given they are just riding over here you can plan in fixtures easily... The rest who currently ride in three and four countries become the adhoc temporary replacements, no doubt happy to get back over here and earn a few quid to top up their other contracts.. Or run a fit for purpose RR system... Guests are just too easy to use. That is the real reason we have them... And of course it means you can bring in ringers at the same time...

I would suggest that this forum is very balanced and full of fans who have lived through the malaise of the sport in this country, with many offering up some, hopefully, constructive ideas, whilst recognising that years of poor leadership cannot be sorted quickly.. With many putting out Ideas to try and improve the obviously glaring issues that led many on here to stop attending, but who still follow the sport closely, (with that gap left by them in the stadiums not getting filled by anyone else to replace their admission money).. However, if the ideas are "Barry White" then really who gives a toss...? It's a forum. For debate... Frequented by a few people who follow a sport frequented by circa 0.03% of the population each week.. I am sure Promoters do "all they can" but sadly many of them have a skill set not aligned to the "entertainment industry" and that is definitely an industry that requires certain specialist skills to firstly attract, then maintain a customer base.. It is over 30 years since I did my marketing degree, but many premises still remain... Sell yourself uniquely to create lots of interest. Try to exceed expectations, but if you cannot do this, at least meet them. Build constant communication with your customers to build long term loyalty. And, listen to them when they give you feedback, both good and bad, (but especially the bad), as you can then improve your offer to them... Bottom line though, is if people aren't coming then even letting them in for nothing can be a huge plus for you if you plan well, and deliver a great night when they come.. The sport suffers massively from so much working in splendid isolation rather than collectively working together. A national marketing initiative would carry far more clout and cut through than each doing their own thing.. Sadly, Speedway seems to be a huge "secret" in the UK, and unless those in charge of it start to work collectively to drive the sport generically, rather than individually, it will probably remain that way.. A truly staggering amount of money (in a sport watched by so few), will get paid in 2022 to riders, riders who with the greatest of respect will put hardly one extra bum on a seat, yet nothing like this amount of money would be spent on advertising and 2022 marketing techniques... Balance that equation and it may help the long term future... However, as I say it's only a forum...

Maybe also down to having not much home advantage too? Most riders make their money by their home scores and the Aces seldom seem to "smash" teams at the NSS.. I would imagine also with the 'need for speed' being so prevalent there that engine maintenance costs could be higher than at some other tracks given the revs needed to compete.. It makes for cracking entertainment but we fans dont pay the (ridiculous) bills to race...

Never understood why clubs do the 'free programme' thing.. The Aces could knock £39 off the season ticket price. (Hell let's go mad and knock forty quid off), and the ST then becomes more worthwhile buying... And they still may sell 13 programmes.. Presume at cost price for them it isnt really three quid so they absorb it, whilst making if sound like a good offer.. But it isn't much of an offer to the many who dont ever buy a programme, so defeats the object.. Edit: Should have added "cant understand why they do ST's full stop anymore". The amount they sell cant make much difference to cash flow surely? All it does do though is negate opportunities to do some "special offers" throughout the season...

"Buy One - Get A Team Place"...

Who cares? The biggest issue of all for the sport (in the UK), is that "winning a league" has zero kudos, no large financial rewards, nor any meaningful media coverage... All down to its lack of credibility... With that as your starting point, it has no chance.. Indeed, any professional sport that ran with such a laughable system would get treated exactly the same... If you havent got enough riders to run seven man teams, then dont.. Instead, change the team structure to suit the supply... Eg Take two riders out from each team so you have a surplus to replace injuries and fixture clashes.. Eg Run with. Two heat leaders, two second strings, one reserve.. Riders obviously need "two jobs" it would appear, so those who ride abroad for one club can ride also for one club over here, riders who already ride for two clubs abroad dont get contracted to ride over here.. All these riders are then on stand by to temporarily replace missing riders in either league if their average fits.. Those lads not riding abroad then double up over here... There are ways you could try and change the system and make winning in UK Speedway actually mean something.. It is clear that those in charge choose not to... And quite correctly they have the right to do so, as they put their money in.. But by the same token, no one should then be surprised that the sport gets such a minimal following, with hardly any public awareness and media coverage, and cannot get "big brands" to associate itself with it... Poland know that they would be in exactly the same place as UK Speedway if it ran with our domestic operating model.. Hence, they dont..

True... It might cost you a whole £50 or so of takings such are the 1000's of teenagers who attend now....

Very, very rarely do you have so many injuries, with, in the main, one rider missing at most.. The main issue is that riders ride on so many nights that an injury on a Monday sees them missing Tuesday and maybe Wednesday.. Then they are back again on Thursday to rinse and repeat.. If they only rode in one division, once a week then they have seven days to improve their health, or provide the clubs with time to bring in a temp signing.. Obviously the major stumbling block to the whole speedway operating model is the 2nd Division... All down to them wanting to be at a level higher than what the 2nd Division should be at.. Which is a stepping stone between Div 3 and Div 1, or a "retirement home" for vastly experienced riders.. The tail of the 2nd Div certainly wags the Div 1 dog... Using the same riders means two teams get impacted though injury, so two meetings then use credibility destroying guests... The clear issue is that to make ends meet (and be seen as a pro sportsman), riders have to race in both leagues, therefore the UK Speedway leaders slavishly follow the guest system because, quite frankly, it is easy to do.. And boosts the riders income too.. The sport needs a root and branch review as to how its own operating model undermines it's own standing amongst its peer sports and reduces its fan base.. But, as we know, it will never happen..

The issue is that hardly any families go, so "special" targeted offers are needed.. The 'die hard' middle aged (and older), people will still attend as they have shown week in week out.. And never mind double amounts needed, to make it pay, you can have a million times no families attending, and you still have nothing... As for 16 to 18 year olds? Let them in too for nothing... These people dont attend, so expecting them to go somewhere and stand with your dad and grandad is pretty much a non starter for the vast majority of them.. Teenagers hunt in packs with mates so let as many in as want to come.. You are not losing a penny by having them there, and it might make the crowd seem bigger so give some atmosphere.. And you will sell some burgers.. And might, just might, get a few to take up following the sport later and pay to get in..

Agreed, however, even Mcd's and other big business's have "bad days" when they let their customers down.. Even if families dont return you havent lost anything only gained, as they are not going now... Energy Bill's will soon be going up by as much as 40% so that is even more of a hit to disposable income, which will push Speedway even further down the priority listing...