Halifaxtiger

On my one visit this season it was way, way better than in previous years.

I tend to find that the opinions of people who 'used to work for the club' can be ridiculously prejudiced and biased. I don't know its the case here, but many of such kind have a massive agenda and axe to grind.

Very different, I agree. But it is unquestionably still the case that one goal counts as two, so any suggestion that speedway is the only sport where points (or goals) double up is untrue.

I thought this was a bit of both: Sheffield were awesome and Glasgow were rubbish. Worrall & Summers were awful and that's the worst I have seen Bewley ride all season (potentially through bike problems). Only a battling effort from Lawson and one or two flashes from Sarjeant will give Glasgow any hope whatsoever. On the other hand, Bates was brilliant and Graversen's signing really was a master stroke. All the others contributed and when you win that well with Howarth having (for him) a slight off night it just shows how good Sheffield are. There simply isn't a weak link.

Yes, Friday and Scunthorpe are attractive especially as Holder and Harris are there.

I don't think anyone doubts your commitment to Workington Speedway. Indeed, I'd say you are precisely the right type of fan - someone who can be critical but remains loyal anyway. I'd reiterate though - Workington have a good team, a good track and good presentation. That's most of what people want from speedway. I also reiterate that I think the promotion deserve better than they are getting. I get taken up to Derwent Park but it still sets me back £50 a time, and I wouldn't do that if the speedway were rubbish. I don't think what Hoggy said did have a pop at anyone who wasn't there but was more about thanking those who were. As to where you spend your money I can't argue with that. But Laura made it absolutely clear that the attendances just aren't big enough and that she needs everyone to come to give her some sort of indication that she could run in 2018. At the very point she needed the help and support of Workington fans more than ever, some decided to go elsewhere. I'll let you decide how she felt about that.

I don't think its illogical to try to make an event more exciting and, as I have said, I doubt if there is a single speedway fan who hasn't seen one meeting that has been significantly improved in terms of almost everything - the racing, the atmosphere, the contest - by a tactical ride, and that's even with the new points system. I wonder if football would have something like it if Chelsea's pitch was three times the size of Arsenal's, its grass twice as long and its goals half the size ? Just possibly they would. As to other sports having 3 points count as 6, how about one goal counting as two ? Differing circumstances maybe, but football most certainly has it. The reasoning behind tactical changes is sound, and that's why it has been in existence in speedway for 50 years or more. As someone has already said, the tactical substitute rule was pretty much never questioned and there's probably a majority who would want to go back to that regardless of the fact that it would create huge additional costs and has the same effect on score lines anyway. Not a good example, but I have seen meetings turn on their head as a result of a tactical ride and improve significantly (from being dead as a door nail to game on) and I'll be surprised if anyone else hasn't. Far exceeds it. Something simply has to be done, because I know serious diehard fans who have had enough because of it.

I agree completely but where Workington is concerned that is simply not true. The Comets have a decent team, a fine racing track and a good promotion who have tried hard to bring success on and off track to the club. They deserve better and as far as I am concerned staying away because Sarjeant is part of the team is nothing more than a cheap excuse not to go.

I disagree to an extent. Both of the Riss brothers pulled off brilliant passing moves - Mark in particular when he got some terrific speed to shoot past Proctor round the final two corners. Funny thing was I thought that it was a battling performance from Campton, Proctor, Williamson & Ostergaard. If Workington had had a decent reserve this would have been much, much closer. Replacing Cook was almost impossible and would have been even if the Comets have tried weeks ago. Over half the league was riding anyway and most of the other top Championship riders were in the Premiership riders meeting. Comets had little choice but to use RR. As to Sarjeant, I'd have sacked him weeks ago and brought in virtually anyone else because they couldn't be that much worse. His ridiculous tendency to get excluded for starting offences is actually getting worse (if that's possible) and once off 15 metres he wasn't interested. Word I got was that he had to be persuaded to stay on after the second exclusion - although he has no-one to blame but himself - and was fined heavily by the referee for delaying the start. I felt desperately sorry for Laura Morgan because no-one can say she hasn't tried hard at Workington. A crowd of 350 or so with no real hope of improvement means just one outcome, because she simply can't continue losing that much per meeting. ​​I really hope I am wrong because a trip up to Cumbria with decent company, a couple of pints and some tea in the town and usually a pretty decent meeting is something I'll miss.

As I say, I haven't missed it in NL meetings at all. That's not true. The logic behind them is clear : they are there to try to make a meeting that would basically be dead in terms of a result more exciting. That's a very good reason to have them and I doubt if there is any regular attender who hasn't seen a meeting improved in terms of its actual quality after one has been used. Truth is, if you are going to have them tactical rides are better, partly - as Orion has pointed out - they affect results less and partly - but more importantly - they involve no additional cost, The question is more about whether there should be some sort of artificial method of changing results at all. My own view was undoubtedly that it should but, as I have mentioned, I really haven't missed them in the NL.

Of course not. But to even suggest that fans interests absolutely override those of everything else is nonsense. It doesn't take a lot of working out to know that the additional costs of tactical substitutes over tactical rides would be huge - its not unreasonable to suggest that just one race could cost £500 or more. Which of us would advocate that the sport take on tens of thousands of pounds worth of additional costs at a point that most speedway tracks are loss making and some are on the brink ? Quite a few, it seems, and to me they are out of touch with reality. On cost grounds alone, the replacement of tactical substitutes with tactical rides was both correct and necessary. Having said that, I really haven't missed tactical changes in NL meetings this season so maybe there is a case for scrapping them altogether.

Not an unreasonable point but Workington have 4 home meetings left so they are into October without any rain offs. I can't help but think that the attendance won't be affected by the absence of Cook and Jorgensen anyway. I think its make your mind up time for the people of Workington to decide whether they want a speedway team or not. Gates haven't been brilliant all season but I am told they have been disastrous recently. Laura Morgan has been pretty honest about the prospects for 2018 unless attendances improve and I hope people respond - its a good racing track, the team is still attractive and the promotion are as good as any.

There's no question that it is a matter of value for money, at least to a degree. The play off final at Belle Vue last season was £25. It was a fantastic meeting in front of a full house with a near cliff edge finish. It was worth every penny and doubt if anyone else who was there thought otherwise.

Personally, I'd say you're easily pleased. You don't care what the product is like as long as the rules are correct. As far as I am concerned, that's bizarre. Speedway fans go to speedway to watch the speedway. The rules and regulations will always be secondary to the quality of the product. I certainly think that there is a change in attitude (albeit a limited one) from the get what you are given to giving you what you want. That's precisely where we need to go. Its the Isle of Wight example that needs to be copied. How about this : An elderly, disabled lady loves speedway but couldn't get to the track, so she used to listen to the sound of the bikes from her garden. Barry Bishop heard about it, arranged a taxi for her and she now comes every week. Doesn't cost the club a penny, as the taxi and entry fee are sponsored. Just how good is that ?

So if the racing was fantastic every week, the presentation incredible, the centre green like Kew Gardens, food 5 star and entry free, you still wouldn't go ? On the other hand, if the racing was rubbish, the presentation non existent and it was £20 to go in but the rules spot on you would ? The racing is everything, because that's why we go. The corruption at the heart of the sport, doubling up and heaven knows what else are infuriating but when I am watching 4 blokes on bikes with brakes tear round a track they rarely count for anything.

From 8 tracks. There are 28 in British Speedway. As such, judgement would be made on less than one third of that available and based upon a handful of meetings. Hardly convincing. Even then, you still can't comment on presentation, delay, facilities and a score of other relevant factors. Agreed, I suspect I'd have more chance of being the next NASA recruit than you would of getting it even if you did apply. I have said this before but on the rare occasions we have chatted I found it to be an education. As such, I'd say you would be an asset.

Yes, indeed, but as I said its about commenting on speedway as a whole. Commenting on others experiences fails to take account of potential bias and is nothing compared to having those experiences yourself. How do you know its great if you are not there to watch it ? You can't base a view on the state of current speedway on experiences from the past, and Isle of Wight is the classic example : you have to be there to know what it is like.

I don't think that's true Dean, short of the fact that while others have had some seriously crooked decisions made in their favour IOW have had nothing. Word is, though, is that Peter Morrish finishes this year and providing we get someone half decent (you, maybe ?) that is a huge step in the right direction for the NL. As far as I am concerned, he is cowardly, incompetent and prejudiced and I can say quite honestly I have never heard a good word about him. What IOW do is actually pretty simple : they treat a paying fan as someone who they want to come back again (as Barry says, dinner at his house). You would have thought that would be standard practice but we all know it is anything but. Hostility, aggression and abuse are common place. That's one of the principle reasons why speedway is on its knees - the take them for granted, if you don't like it, don't come, doing us a favour attitude that seems to pervade almost everywhere. 5 for me and I live in Yorkshire. Only Scunthorpe, Sheffield, Belle Vue & Workington will top that. I loathe intervals but IOW make them part of the show and there's no doubt that the highlight for some of the children attending is the bike and running race at interval time. Without that, its possible that they (and their parents) might not come. Compare that to standing around getting cold, annoyed and unhappy at Birmingham on Wednesday when they had their interval. On your last two points, spot on. The moaners don't affect me, though, nor should they affect anyone else because that's all they do. Their view isn't balanced, fair or objective, its biased unfair and subjective so you can just basically ignore them. In addition, most of them don't go. That means you can't comment on the racing, the presentation, the stadium or any other aspect of what goes on during a meeting. How you can have an informed opinion on speedway as a whole without that is beyond me.

Personally, I'd say the insult is that Panthers could have had a stronger line up but chose not to - with or without Boxall.

His departure wasn't exactly on good terms. I trust that isn't an attempt to justify the selection of Boxall for Harris because it doesn't cut it at all.

Beyond criticism if that is true. Whatever the situation with Ged Rathbone and whether you agree with BSPA/SCB actions where he is concerned, to then deliberately sabotage another club's - and one which has only recently indicated their financial difficulties - chances of pulling in a paying attendance is both vicious and repugnant. Whatever has happened n British speedway this season, for me this is a new low and, if it can be found that Peterborough are tracking a team that is weaker than that that would be available, they should be heavily fined.

Word I have is that that is absolutely untrue and that Michael Palm Toft is ready to load his van up as a guest for Wilson-Dean or Harris. Despite the fact that that would undoubtedly make them stronger on track, they have chosen to include Roynon even though they are well aware of the acrimonious state of affairs between Roynon and the Workington promotion. This could have serious consequences and, if so, that will be entirely down to Peterborough.

I suspect that part of the reason for that is that they have no wish to boast about just how poor that Peterborough team is. I was due to go today but for a couple reasons I can't now. Having seen that Panthers line up - and this is absolutely no fault of Workington's whatsoever - I am not unhappy about it. Its extremely difficult to believe that they couldn't get someone better than Boxall, especially taking into account that he rode at Plymouth last night. That sort of utter selfishness and the lack of concern about another club's fortunes is one of the principle reasons why speedway is on its knees.

Very different in one sense to King's Lynn : that wasn't abandoned by the referee. Rory Schlein is undoubtedly a trouble maker in these circumstances (and I'd agree that he should consider whether he should continue to be a speedway rider) but its difficult to suggest that he didn't have a very real case here. I have absolutely no reason to question Pirate Nick's integrity and would therefore accept his comments without any doubts at all, and I can't believe that Barbara Horley would call a meeting off if the riders (or even a majority of them) wanted to continue. Nick is also right about preparing a decent track surface because even if this meeting had continued to the end it would surely have been ruined as a spectacle by riders considering their safety rather than beating the opposition. In this case, it appears to me that fingers should be very much pointed at Peterborough speedway rather than the referee or any particular rider and if they are in difficulties they are the masters of their own downfall.

Agreed. That wasn't Scunthorpe's fault, though. I thought in the time it took to prepare the track Workington could have got changed and warmed the bikes up and we would be away. I couldn't believe it when they did a track walk - and Rob didn't look too pleased either. The fact that it was 45 minutes was down to the referee. Without his intervention, it would have been longer. One other thing : James Sarjeant showing off after race Mind you, he didn't anticipate the formidable Mrs Godfrey having a word afterwards HT always gives good fair comments on Scorpions meetings. Had Auty and MPT ridden as they usually do . the win could have been for Scorpions. However they obviously didn't like or couldn't get on with the dry dusty track! so no blame on them! That's why I like the night meetings....please night meetings next year Rob! Rob has said they will go back to night meetings if they get the gates. Definitely better speedway in the evenings, but no-one can blame him for sticking with Sundays if attendances are better. Speaking of that, Sunday was one of the better ones this season.