Halifaxtiger

Really ? PL average for Scunthorpe 2016 5.42 I'm not a fan. At Scunny he was brilliant if he gated, not interested if he didn't.

Problem is the fact that he moved in in the knowledge that the stadium was there cuts no ice with the law, as Mildenhall found out. Bloody stupid but that's how it is.

Yes. Never saw him pass anyone though http://speedwayupdates.proboards.com/thread/14825/buxton-kent-nl-02-2015

Because I don't doubt that your interest in the prosperity and continuing existence of Cradley Heathens greatly exceeds that of that of your local supermarket. That means that you should be concerned if your club is living way beyond its means (and rider pay is probably the largest expense that any club has). Some almost certainly do and, in a number of cases, we are talking 5 figure sums every year. To answer your question, in purely financial terms they are less a business and more a personal hobby, with the management having the financial clout to meet the losses.

Completely agree and its not that he scores points, but how he does it. I won't forget seeing him ride Buxton a couple of seasons ago for Kent. Never seen anyone else tackle it like he did.

Probably because you and I contribute towards their earnings and we have a serious interest in the financial viability of their employers. Where the NL is concerned, I think that is because it is generally in better financial shape than the other leagues. To my knowledge, the only club struggling badly finance wise last season was Plymouth but even they didn't get near some of the losses made in the top two divisions.

Not bitter at all, just realistic. Speedway (with the exception of the top boys) is not and never has been a full time occupation even during the season. One of speedway's most intractable yet vitally important questions is how to make some see that. Attendances and income at NL dictate that it must largely self funded, although Dean has said in the past that even at that level you can at least breakeven if you do everything yourself. He's a former speedway rider who competed at NL level for many years. That means he knows about the income and expenditure. For that reason alone, he's worth listening to.

I think we need Jayne Moss to state the case clearly again. If memory serves me correctly, she preferred a situation where NL clubs could not have assets which suggests its nowhere near as simple as you are putting it nor is it the case that NL clubs are as hard done by as you imply. Actually NL clubs receive a training fee (albeit not much) when the rider signs for a higher club and they pay no loan fees for riders who are assets of other teams (Josh Bailey & Richard Knight spring to mind). The amount they pay the BSPA is definitely substantially less and a referee does exactly the same job at whatever meeting he attends, so why should some be charged more than others ? I think it was one ex Championship promoter who said that some NL clubs want all the benefits of being in the Premiership and Championship but don't want to pay for it. This is particularly relevant taking into account that NL clubs are in general in better financial shape than those in the top two divisions. In addition, to suggest that NL clubs receive no reward for training young riders is nonsense. The financial gain from other clubs maybe minimal, but clearly if you put time and effort (the money commitment is almost non existent, indeed Isle of Wight make money from their training school) into giving youngsters a chance it means they are more likely to stay with your club, hugely benefitting the team in the short term. As an example, Mildenhall will have Kemp, Bebee, Jenkins and Marson riding for them this season. All have been given opportunities by the Fen Tigers and repaid the clubs loyalty by joining them at the start of their NL careers. Every single Mildenhall fan I know, not surprisingly, can't wait for the season to start. Isn't the on - and indeed off - track success of an NL club enough for them to have a strong youth and training policy ?

Its definitely the case that the NL clubs pay significantly less in fees than the top two leagues and one of the reasons for that is they cannot sign assets. I know Jayne Moss put a very good post on here regarding NL clubs owning assets and its nowhere near as clear cut as it seems.

You could argue the same about the top leagues. I wonder if Craig Cook is paid the same amount per point as Jack Smith or whether Zach Wajtknecht got the same as Jason Doyle. In my experience, the number of points that a rider can score has little to do with the amount he gets per point.

I have done over 700 meetings at every track in the UK in the last 12 or so seasons and I haven't been to many where its been as blatant as that. In addition, don't we all try to avoid a potential rain off ? I know I do. I don't mind a meeting reaching heat 10 and being called off even if the conditions were the same at heat 7, and there is a good reason for that. One NL promoter told me that a rain off had cost him £4,000 and that two more like it would have closed the track. I was chatting with him at the start of one meeting with no rain predicted and a few spots came down (possibly signalling some heavy stuff) and the look on his face was scary. Getting to heat 10 - even if it is a bit fixed - avoids that and this isn't penny pinching (like full price insert programmes) this is the very future of the track. Where I do agree, though, is when meetings are abandoned to suit one side or the other, the infamous Belle Vue-Poole EL Semi Final the other year being the prime example. That is just not on.

Its little wonder that TaylorJ has got annoyed. I have no reason to doubt the figure stated and that sort of amount makes a huge difference to any speedway track - quite possibly the difference between survival and closure. That's not a matter for ridicule. I have it on good authority that the Workington Speedway Trust is hugely valued, and rightly so.

I can't agree. Its occasionally the case that there is a hope that the rain will stop and it just gets worse instead. I think there has to be a realisation as to just how much a rain off with all the spectators in the stadium will cost a promoter, because its thousands even at most NL clubs. For that reason, it is rare that a meeting is called off in those circumstances unnecessarily.

I also think Bickley will go to Workington. This was apparently agreed some time ago. Jenkins is a possibility and he'd be a fantastic catch.

in truth, it should be semi professional at that level anyway. Part of the problem the sport has is that too many riders believe that it is a full time occupation when it isn't and, indeed, for most never has been. Mick Bell was at reserve when Coventry won the British League in 1978 & 79. He commented later that speedway, for him, was little more than a 'good paying hobby'. It could be that the reduction in meetings is due to the fact that most tracks lose money. More meetings, more losses. In truth, I am not certain that this is such a bad thing. Tracks could open up in early April, run the League Cup campaign and the first round of the KO Cup fortnightly and then go weekly from mid May until then end of August - about 15 weeks to get in 10 or so fixtures. That means that the season will be run in the height of the summer, when its warmer for fans and there's less chance of rain. Play offs & the KO Cup Final can be completed in early September. The blank weeks allow time for rain offs, absences and tracks running on the same night.

Did a show with Barry last season on the Island and I was astonished at the amount of interest it raised. I could remind everyone that every Warriors gate last season (bar one) was up on the corresponding meeting in 2016 and that gates have increased around 5 fold on what the previous promotion achieved. Any promotion that can manage that surely has to be worth listening to.

Free tickets are not loss revenue unless they are picked up by someone who is going anyway, in which case that person will be well aware of the importance of them continuing to pay at the gate and not using it. While it cannot be unlimited, a free ticket used by someone who doesn't go is no financial loss at all and may indeed have the result of them paying next time.

I think he's an excellent signing. Little disappointing last season but he can still beat anyone in the NL. In addition its not just that he scores points, but how he scores them. I doubt it - it would need an increase in the points limit for that and I can't see that happening.

Indeed you can.

Certainly where loss making is concerned speedway is little different to other sports. The losses incurred and debts owed by Championship football clubs are millions and tens of millions. Bolton are the worst : their debt after the 2015/16 season was pushing £200m, an eye watering figure which even when you take relative turnover, crowds and income into account makes losses run up by speedway promoters look like chicken feed. In addition, the clubs are almost entirely owned by wealthy individuals with money to burn. https://www.insidermedia.com/insider/national/football-finance-championship-club-by-club-2015-16

Bewley is a fantastic signing, but 2018 will be a huge season for him. After a brilliant 2016, I had him being a heat leader in the Championship last season but he never really got above a good second string even though he put best part of two points on his average. His best, it seemed to me, was when he was out for the Aces or the Colts. Fingers crossed he kicks on big time for the Comets in 2018.

The fact that a club has given a young rider track time, encouragement and the benefit of their experience must count for something. Money simply cannot be the sole factor in determining what team to sign for. I am aware of at least one young rider who got his fingers badly burnt by signing - against advice - for the highest bidder and two of the most talented who have remained loyal to the club that gave them the initial support that they needed despite, in one case, a thinly veiled attempt to poach them away.

They continued to lose money at Eastbourne. A lot of it.

In actual fact, its both. Isle of Wight's gates double in the holiday season (an extra 300 per week) and that's the difference between survival and closure. While I accept that some places are too far away to reasonably attract anyone, some are not. In a holiday destination, you simply have to let those who do not live in an area know that you are there. Workington just don't do that.

It was indeed and he was re-assessed as a 5.00. Word I got was Mildenhall put the boot in and NL management backed down, probably because 5.00 doesn't exist in the rulebook for riders and Marson, as a British passport holder who had never ridden in the NL, should be a 3.00. No reason why he shouldn't be this season. Very good start to team building indeed.