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Most off topic posts hidden from last two days. Please keep to the topic. Thanks

And what do you want me to talk about the company I was employed by is no more 2018 cost over 30k I have invested 10k for 2019 already and you want me to talk about fans

Difference being the Edinburgh promotion value the supporters and everything they do for the club. The Berwick Supporters on the other hand are not as appreciated by there promotion or there mouthpiece but that dosent make them any less important.

Edinburgh’s fans probably are the best for keeping there club afloat every year they raise some amount of money I applaud them

Whilst I'm really not a fan in the slightest about dropping down a league, the Somerset promotion have done what they believe to be the best course of action to make the sport sustainable. What should be sending even more alarm bells to all teams in the whole country, is that if Somerset "couldn't" make it pay - a team who owns their own track, car park, bar and catering facilities with no rent to pay - then what chance do the rest of them have?

For somebody who use to be pit based in the late 60's ,70's & 80's I was on first name with nearly all the riders , You'll be amazed at the corners they cut to save money, many riders hosed the bikes down at the end of the meeting in readiness for the next. Back then Terry Betts use to say a new bike would last him a whole season without any major problems. Oil and adjust the chain, and on the next meeting. He used to have a new tyre and chain once a month and was always competitive. High in the rankings, he was regarded as a top rider in his time. His costs were manageable but even then he also worked in his own garage to supplement his earnings.... No, he didn't ride in other countries and there were no SGP series, but the sport was popular and well supported. There is no reason why that scenario cant be re-created . The BSPA have to forget about other countries, other leagues, and the SGP and concentrate on creating a new beginning. This has to be done on cheaper bikes, sealed against tuning, and admission priced at a cost to attract the fans back. As long as the races were competitive, it wouldn't matter if the heats were slower. Leave the tuned bikes for the SGP. if the top riders wanted to race here, then they could on our terms, on bikes similar to all the others . Plans for survival have to be implemented now making bikes ready for 2020. The clock is ticking and time is running out fast This idea offers so much potential but by doing nothing our sport is destined to die....

On point 1, no money raising is done within the Stadium as the Club stopped allowing it despite still expecting donations, they also stopped the SC from doing the 50/50 draw and the last time a significant donation was made (past promotion) it was for a new medical room, the money was handed over and nothing ever happened of it/it has never been used to this day. The bad blood between the Supporters Club and the Club was being patched up with Scott Courtney and the SC but since he has stepped down there has been numerous articles on the website taking digs at the supporters club and I don’t think Jamie has once made contact with them to try and sort anything out. If John Anderson treated his fans a bit better non of this would be happening I don’t think, I know it’s a different promotion but they havn’t been going the best way about it recently have they?

And then they have to lose a rider and Ipswich get him. It would be like a Danish fairy tale

January Update: OUR first meeting of 2019 saw members of the Campaign Group back at Rugby Council offices on January 9.Attending the meeting were the Leader of Rugby Council Michael Stokes; the new Head of Growth and Investment Stephanie Chettle-Gibrat; the Development and Enforcement Manager Nick Freer; and the Principal Planning Officer dealing with the Brandon Estates application, Erica Buchanan.One of the main reasons for the meeting was to take the officers through our latest document to be submitted.Given the volume of material which has been generated over the last two years, and especially since the planning application, we have pulled much of it together – and also included new information – into a single document summarising the errors and untruths contained within the planning material submitted by Framptons. Unsurprisingly, this is once again a hefty document!Those who were present at our Public Meeting last November will recall Cllr Stokes’ announcement that an independent consultant was to be appointed, at considerable expense to the Council, in order to go through the material from all sides and provide an informed response from within the sporting sector.We warmly welcomed that news as we are 100 per cent confident that the information we have submitted, which is accompanied by clear and indisputable evidence rather than vague jargon, will stand up to examination.Supporters are reminded that Framptons/Brandon Estates are attempting to make the case that Brandon Stadium closed down due to the non-viability of running speedway and stock cars (which had successfully run together for over 60 years); and that sufficient alternative venues exist elsewhere in the Midlands to ensure there is no ongoing need for either a return to Brandon or for an alternative site to be provided in the Coventry/Rugby area.We believe their application and follow-up material are totally non-compliant with National Planning Policy Framework regarding open space, sport and recreation facilities, and we welcome the fact that they will be subject to outside scrutiny.The independent consultant has now been appointed, and we already have a meeting scheduled with him for later this month.As to the question of when the planning application will go to committee, we can say that it is not currently imminent for two reasons.Firstly, it clearly cannot happen until the independent consultant has completed his report, and although this extends the time period we see the appointment as a positive step and proof of how seriously the Council take the matter.Secondly, the final Local Plan report from the Government Inspector had not been received as of last Wednesday, and another pledge from Cllr Stokes at the Public Meeting was that the application would not be heard until this has been completed.So although we do appreciate the frustration that this process has so far taken nearly a year from the submission of the application, we urge supporters to be patient – and we can assure them that we have options in mind to react to several potential scenarios in future.Once again our thanks are due to the senior members of the Council for making the time to meet with us, and fully engaging with what we had to say.As ever, we will endeavour to update supporters whenever possible as matters develop over the coming weeks and months.

So basically the product being offered for this season is yet further watered down than it has been the last few years, yet the prices have been raised? Alongside this, its entirely the duty of the supporters club to hand over to the club every penny they make? And the justification is simply that they should just be grateful that the speedway is being kept going? Sorry but this is the 21st century and speedway is vastly overpriced for the product people get to see and the amount of guest riders they see for riders riding elsewhere at any given time and any amount of other excuses that are made when it suits throughout a season. If a supporters group wish to put on trips for their members then thats entirely their prerogative there shouldnt be articles written by that prat regarding the matter. I think its about time speedway broadly moved itself away from the self praise it craves just for ‘keeping the speedway going’. If you put on a great product and get the entertainment spot on, the crowd would take care of itself. If you dont, I dont see why clubs can turn around and be surprised/offended when people dont go anymore.

Could this be to do with the reductions for British riders Speedway Star today quotes that Ipswich have 13.48 points available for the final 2 signings For this to be correct it would mean King and Lawson DO NOT get the reduction So either the Speedway Star is wrong or the goalposts have moved which impacts some completed teams....... Again a lack of transparency leaves fans in the dark

Curious suggestion......! Couldn’t possibly think who you mean!? Be a laugh tho wouldn’t it

Fortunately he can't be at all 3 tracks on a Thursday night

Just scrolled through all team declarations ,and was both sad and pleased to see that Adam Roynan is not listed on any team sheet.Adam must be one of the bravest riders to ever take to the track.He as suffered some horrific injury's during his career most of witch should have been enough to make most men retire ,if this is the end for Adam i am sure he will be remembered as one brave bloke.

For goodness sake - you tried to disrupt the lakeside thread on a similar subject, why don't you just leave the things you mention to the folks who put their hard earned time and money on the line for this cause. It's actually an insult imo for you to post something like this. So pompous. Best wishes to everyone connected with the Coventry cause - don't let such negativity from pillocks like this disrupt the passion you all have.

Don't be sad badge,,, much better than the other 2. Just keep a spare wall heater handy, and some nice warm dry shale

U thought of moving to glasgow lol

See you have inherited the forum fannies.

As there is no clarity over what the rule is, it is hard to tell what it is for.

As has been often covered Speedway has such a unique setup that it makes it very hard to implement a one size fits all approach. We have tracks that are owned outright and used solely for Speedway, owned but multi use, leased solely for speedway and leased dual purpose. The majority of stadia require Speedway to continue to bring any value to those venues. Yet we are in a situation whereby the promotions running are struggling to stay in business. That is what all Speedway teams need to be treated as, a business and that needs to be able to at the very least break even year on year. Currently the sport relies on a few fortunate individuals who are able to plough huge amounts of their own money into clubs to keep them afloat, i think everyone is aware that is not in any way a sustainable business model.

In the final round of Pointless today, one of the questions was name anyone who came in the first three in BBC's Sports Personality of the Year in the 1960s. Barry Briggs was a pointless answer. An easy £4250, but, sadly, the contestants didn't say him.

Workington outbidding Somerset with money they clearly didn't have is both foolish and idiotic. Work within your means!

doesn't have to be completely amateur but just don't pay what you can't afford. Its that simple really

The supporters club have supported the club in very real terms over the years, they have given substantial donations for the purchase of a new fence, the purchase of a second ambulance, loan fee for riders and many many more. In fact without the supporters club and its donation I suspect Berwick Speedway would've gone by now. The thing I find most distasteful about Mr Barrie`s article is the way we are categorised, either fan or supporter, to me they are one and the same. Anyone spending their money to attend meetings, and in many cases making sacrifices to do so deserve better. It is true there were differences between the club and the supporters club last season but as has already been mentioned bridges were being built. This topic was debated on here and looked to have been put to bed, at least partially, now that can have of worms has been opened again, I will only make the point I made at the time, the club would do well not to pick a fight with its most loyal and those who help the club either directly or in-directly as there is only one winner there.

Surely, A supporters club run by supporters, is a supporters club, of which the supporters decide on what any funds are spent on. A supporters club run by the club, is a funding stream run by the club for it's own benefit, and should not be called a supporters club, as it is without the control of the supporters. The way to support a club is to pay through the turnstiles. The clubs responsibility is to provide adequate entertainment to achieve that.

Don't talk absolute rubbish. The lad has lost his job and as hard as it is for the fans, it's nothing compared to the riders. It's their livelihood and we're at a point now where it's getting harder and harder each year to truly make a living in speedway. And let's not pretend that Bickley hasn't been loyal to workington. It says a lot when a rider admits he was aware the situation wasn't good, more than likely had offers elsewhere and still sticks with them. That speaks great volume to a young rider like Kyle who could've easily moved on but didn't and unfortunately he's now paying the price. Out of all of the riders he's probably the most fortunate as he is more likely to pick up another team. But until he has another team, then it simply means nothing.

Except Kyle doesn't ignore the fans, quite the opposite he is polite, courteous and considerate towards them but when a journalist asks you how much you spent on equipment last year you answer honestly. When the same asks how much you have spent for the forthcoming season you answer honestly, when you are asked if you are pizzed off you answer honestly. It's not hard to work out surely even you can see that article wasn't written and published by Kyle Bickley!

all riders earn their money. kyle invests to get better and progress in his chosen sport . one day mate , you will be up there . was looking forward to seeing your 2nd year in the championship. looks like i may have to get the passport renewed to see you race .. stick in kid , ya got it .

Fans, who pay the money that pay your wages. Ignore them at your peril. No fans, no speedway, no job.

They have faith in their Promotion who have been at the helm of the Club for a long time ,that counts for a lot IMO.They have been fortunate that their main money men back the club to the hilt.

Don't get me wrong i know team speedway is very well loved in this country and when done well its an excellent sight to behold but its clear it is struggling. But as my business vision would be to have a touring series of individual meetings (possibly pairs & 4TT too?) would that actually provide enough to keep a lot of tracks open? Probably not as the rough thought process in my head is to hire the venue and promote independently but the likelihood is that rents would be increased year on year as the series success took off. There are a lot of riders who pay pretty high fees to ride at amateur level and likewise grasstrack has the same approach but can still draw good crowds. Whilst not always a hit with the purists a mixture of solo and sidecar speedway at an event would double the spectator draw and entertainment value.

With the rumours of no Rob Grant doing food and no Dennis behind the scenes anymore with Scott already stating he wasn’t going to be helping a lot are we going to last very long at all? being honest.

As stated "you are not aware of the facts surrounding the demise of Workington Speedway" they haven't "Gone to the wall" as you have so eloquently put it; however you have your own opinion and I respect that; but it needed pointing out that 1. BWD didn't want to go back to Somerset this year and 2. the deal wasn't the breaker as no matter how much GM did or did not offer BWD he didn't want to go back to the OTA and finally 3. BWD did not want to ride for Somerset in 2019... are you picking up on the theme here Now Charles Wright who said he would ride for Somerset then changed direction and headed off to Redcar; well who knows what his reason was for doing that, but no doubt you will have your own opinion on that one as well Regards THJ

The trouble with what you say, is that Belle Vue's 'comfortable' position, is not felt by most other set-ups and let's be honest, it has been touch and go for even Belle Vue over the years. I think if you just think about your own speedway team, you run the risk of either being the 'last man standing' or you find what you thought was a safe and secure club, underneath is in serious problems. Not that I'm suggesting that is the case with Belle Vue. Where you are lucky though, is you have a great stadium and let's face it, it is dubbed a national speedway stadium, therefore, if speedway went amateur, your stadium would be great for different individual events and perhaps even a GP event! Which means you should still see plenty of quality action!

The Save Coventry campaign has had promises from a large number of people/companies/tradespeople to help restore the stadium, as well as financial support for the work involved.

Writing in bold is good though, for those of us with dodgy minces! But 'squaring the circle' is what this thread is all about. Riders have financial needs, yes, but there are not enough punters or promoters with deep enough pockets to meet the costs. So speedway either limps along as it has done and hopes a miracle happens or in other words, speedway buries its head in the sand or someone or some thing, grasps the nettle and starts to think outside the box.

I've been banging on for year's saying make the limit 42 in all 3 leagues and set it for 2/3 seasons. Everyone knows where they are at the begining and end of season and can build accordingly straight away. Will never happen though too simple.

Agree with this except that the sport has done away with individual meetings, open track licences etc. and therefore is a closed shop. Ride for a club and do as they say or your options are limited to non existent. The riders are not a special case it is those in charge who limit or restrict the options for young talent to be involved in competitive racing which is what they need to really test them and they do this by saying in the main, it is team racing or nothing. You could also blame the clubs who vote through decisions at the AGM and cannot see further then the next team meeting. Without the open meetings and/or a decent second half to the main match in which it is open to all comers of a reasonable standard where they can race against more experienced riders, the talent that is around will take much longer to come through the ranks and probably lose the will to live before they ever make a mark in the sport.

So dick decides to get a little personal about some supporters. Yes they are both fans and supporters. They buy season tickets or pay at the gate . Buy a programme and purchase beveridges and the likes at the club bars. Go to away meetings too support , yes again that word support their team . They have giving donations too the club and to the riders too help with equipment. Dick now tells us the riders are well paid . If that’s the case dick last season they must have been very very well paid if they have taken the wage cuts Jamie said at the meeting. The supporters of this club want nothing more than too see a team race in a Saturday and I’m sure they are all grateful to Jamie and his team for allowing them to continue for another season. What they don’t need is a mouthpiece spouting off what he thinks some people want to hear and too slag off supporters on an official website is a bit embarrassing to say the least . Put it on your own blog dick.

Can you see if you can get a slot at the next BSPA AGM, would make a great presentation to kick off the event. Hard to disagree with anything you've said.

The plan they follow is astoundingly unfit for purpose. In fact it is so far away from being suitable it is truly laughable to think sane men and women sign it off every year.. Promoters spend hours contriving meetings, cobbled together with random septets that some cannot afford, sharing riders together, and all to win a competition which, by their very own operating model, is rendered completely worthless... They collectively must spend literally Millions of pounds each year, all trying to win a competition that they 100% completely devalue by the very way that they run it.... You seriously couldn't make it up could you? Lets be honest, who cares who wins a Speedway prize in the UK? It has zero kudos. So therefore how do you ever hope to attract a crowd to engage with it? You then compound the issue by putting together 'teams' of random riders who may be available to ride for you if they haven't got another better paying job on, or are already double booked elsewhere, and expect fans to become emotionally attached to that club. (Like a team sport should get you involved).. The riders they sign are then expected to have the best equipment at their disposal to 'win' some silverware. The best equipment that costs them a ridiculous amount each year. And all to keep up with other riders who are doing exactly the same.. The riders then (quite understandably) wants recompense for their increased annual outlay. Outlay that actually achieves nothing more than allowing them to 'run to stand still' against their peers. Peers who will be paying out the same, to the same people, using the same top equipment, and getting it expensively tuned by the same tuners.. The Promoters therefore then pay out those Millions of pounds to the riders in the vain hope that they can win something hardly anyone cares about, as 99.9% of the population of this country don't attend a single Speedway meeting (and a big percentage won't even know it exists).. Just to add further 'magic' to the cunning plan, meetings are often arranged around their riders agenda rather than when the fans can attend, leaving meetings crammed in in the dark days of winter after having months of summer devoid of Speedway.. You can then add on an admission fee that is set at the level it is to desperately offset the huge outlay that they choose to pay out, rather than a reflection of the quality of what they are actually selling.. All of the above plan has no place or investment for a national marketing plan it should be noted... Millions paid to riders that the vast majority of the UK have never heard of. In a sport that most people have never heard of. Yet hardly anything spent on marketing.. You spend Millions on the sport yet (astonishingly), run it this way? A truly quite incredible situation and concept isn't it? It should go amateur? Could that be regarded as a step up in certain areas?

Whatever happens in the future for Workington, Laura has got my full respect. To put so much of her own money into the club she obviously loved is amazing, in my opinion.

When on Twitter, the club said they are counting down the days, I thought they were referring to the team announcement rather than the start of the season. Probably someone ought to inform them we need a team before we can start to imagine a new season....

In fairness to Vince, it is his son who used to ride speedway. It seems as though Vince may participate in another weekend type motor sport, maybe pre-65 scrambles, where you probably don't get prize money, but may get a cup/shield etc, as are many amateur motor sports. I think you could run speedway on an amateur basis and still have teams. Often amateur participants are more dedicated to their sport, so the argument that you wouldn't get the commitment from the team, I think is unfounded. In any case, if you had a team of amateurs, you could afford to have plenty of reserves, for the occasions when riders are unable to race.

Totally agree If they dont qualify then it possibly affects Ipswich less as we are yet to finalise the team Imagine if you have your 1-7 sorted and then the reductions are restrospectively not ratified........

Not feeling any excitement at all for the Brummies 2019 season has the fact we have built a pretty uninspiring side led to that ??

Obviously a better deal than Somerset offered !!, and there you have it, a team pleading poverty which proved correct in the end as they withdrew from the league, and yet offering more than Somerset did. Clubs need to be sensible with their deals, with tracks folding.

Not enough I would imagine, hence why the club has withdrawn. Speedway has this nasty habit of trying to limit the amount of people and fans it loses, instead of trying to attract new fans. Keep bumping the prices up forcing numbers to decrease further and further until eventually the business is completely unsustainable is not a good business plan. Spin King Junior has hit the nail on the head about the scare tactics.

Ha ha....but true,. BSPA blame everyone and anyone but themselves. The sport being run into the ground by Buster, who is a complete clown, is now doomed.

Honestly When has Speedway ever been fair? Regards THJ