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The NL IS developing riders whilst also being a competitive league that people want to pay money for to watch. Look at Bewley, Bickley, Kemp, Edwards, Jenkins, Atkins, Mountain, Hume, Shanes, Bacon, Bowtell, Thomas, Stoneman, Brennan, Wood etc and all these riders have successfully made the step up or are very close to it. Ripping apart this league and making it full of sides like that Scunthorpe Stags team recently is not going to get fans to turn up and watch them and not going to prepare these riders for the step up!

There is the problem . The BSPA should be telling the clubs the dates the meetings have to be held , not leaving it to the clubs humming and hawing and squabbling over it . Why bother with play offs when you get this kind of nonsense .

Absolutely pointless, everyone's contract will say 20 quid per point. But not everyone will only receive that. The stories I am hearing from people in the know is a) essentially what Mark Phillips has said b) 5 man teams being the alternative. The strongest suggestions are that either scenario will force clubs like Brum, Eastbourne,Iow, Kent,and Mildenhall up a league. Whatever the outcome The National League as we know it (the strongest league of all, mainly due to the BSPA totally ignoring it) looks set to be ripped apart to prop up the mess of the top 2 flights,that the BSPA have let go down the drain. I can see positives in this if the 2nd tier can run mainly on British riders, one current promoter suggested to me that next year's championship 2nd strings would be NL number 1s and Championship reserves would be NL heat leader and better 2nd strings level. I believe from piecing together various bits of info, rumour, gossip, and speculation that by running 2 bigger top flight leagues, and then a pure development league it may make it easier to step up a level. And make the steps more achievable. Other forms of motorcycle racing have levels of ability. For example Club racing- national series- moto 3- moto 2 - moto gp. To get more lads (and lasses) riding speedway their has to be a clearer path to progress along. As it stands a top national league rider can earn more then a championship reserve, but if he stepped up to championship he would earn less then the original reserve as he won't be of the standard. So one is riding (and struggling) away at CL level, and a slightly lesser rider can almost earn a living out of maxing out at NL. Which rider is better of in the long run though? If we want a string of World Beaters which eventually attract main stream tv media, and then more sponsorships. There has to be some incentive to jump up through the leagues. Question to Mark Phillips if the upper leagues are expanded and using most of the competent National League riders in the teams, would this significantly lower costs and make it more viable. And I have read various comments from Plymouth/Stoke/Brum and even Eastbourne fans say they would only return when higher league racing returned. Do you think these people would add significant numbers to the gate, and in turn make it more viable still? Plymouth is a great venue, despite the pig of a journey and the match day entertainment is up there with market leading IOW, so would be an awful loss to the sport. I totally see the rumoured national league proposals making it totally unviable for many clubs, I d suggest the limit of 32 would take gates at my club down by at least half. These things need sorting out now, the powers that be need to be having meetings on a weekly basis and at least get the skeleton of a proposal together, and then consult us last few mugs prepared to do 500 mile round trips to support our team to gauge our opinions. Every time the BSPA lock themselves in a room, someone or something seems to get screwed up, stupidity must be summed up by the saying "you can keep doing the same things and expecting different results" Someone independent needs to get involved in the process and stop the year on year decline in every aspect of the sport, whilst the BSPA think they the best interests at heart, this will always be tainted with their own personal interests. So the committee essentially needs a dictator. Personally I d get Barry Bishop in as the chairman, if he can't breath life into the sport I can't think of many that could. Don't take any of this post as statement of fact, it is purely the ramblings of a frustrated and passionate fan, and a picture painted in my head by the snippets of info and mainly rumours I 've heard along the way.

Cheers for that , bufoon is the first word that springs to mind at your inane slavering but it is hilarious reading your one woman crusade at insulting the A - Z of members.

This seems to be dragging on so much that I’ve no idea why there was a cut off date at 16th September , Workington could have raced there final home fixture by now and finished 2nd in the table thus giving them choice of either the first leg or second. Its obvious both clubs will only race when it suits them, unfortunately if they can’t sort it out between them the Bspa will have to intervene and force a deadline, which I’m surprised hasn’t already been forced. Regardless of who is right or wrong, reading this thread it’s pissing people off already , it just wouldn’t happen in any other sport!

Breaking News The play off dates have been announced for the Glasgow Tigers Vs Workington Comets meetings Friday the 23rd at Glasgow and Saturday the 24th at Workington These two dates in November suit both clubs as it will mean they both race on their chosen race nights and it will give Craig Cook time for his injury to fully heal and for Glasgow to put James Sarjeant on the Atkins Diet and get a stone off him as he has been looking a bit chunky lately, both should be fighting fit and raring to go... Cant beat a bit of clout eh! Regards THJ Oops sorry just been advised "Fake News"

One big league worked in the 60s but it only lasted two yers the last time it was tried. The big difference I see between now and the 60s is that the element of freshness (Provincial League supporters seeing the big NL stars, NL supporters seeing the PL young guns) no longer applies because doubling up has meant that even in one big league the riders would be largely similar to what we've been seeing recently. Another difference would be that in British speedways last existential crisis, there were promoters about who had the drive, energy and confidence to get through big changes. Are there those sort of people around now? It's a pity because instinctively, as an old-timer, I like the idea of a big league. Variety of fixtures, continuity and one visit by a team per season so ,if you want to see jason Doyle riding you have to go when Somerset are in town and not shrug your shoulders and put it off until their second visit.

Poor attempt at humour if that’s what you were implying, Speedway can’t afford to lose any clubs.

I heard a rumour the playoffs are to be held in March 2019 when Dan Bewley is fit. Siousie.

Err the monarchs have been waiting 4 workington to complete their KOC leg against newcastle since july I believe when Edinburgh qualified for the semis... so maybe its only right the get 1st dibs on this weekend as they have been waiting longer! Maybe you should check facts before you post!!!!!!

Workington asked Glasgow to come to them on Sat 6/10 without COOK we said yes as Glasgow wanted second leg our choice we asked Workington to come to us Sun 7/10 our alternative race day Workington said NO.That would have left 3 weekends for your 3 pos finals and 1 league meeting

Fans who want to see the top boys need to get a grip on reality and realise the more we keep chasing the dream of our league system been respected alongside Poland and Sweden the more trouble clubs over here will get into, we just don't have the fan base to pay these riders and riders over here need to realise the sport here at moment is at a semi professional level so don't expect much more. Speedway here needs to strip it back and pay what we can afford, improve the product in general and have less drama and bad press releases. Once the product improves and we can then maybe look at a proper tv deal if we are giving them something they want to pay for, right now they clearly don't value it so clearly something needs to change and not just for them but for us. I would go with the one league system or one i sent into BSPA was this North/South Split (with the clubs from top PL & CL currently running) 18 Teams as it stands North Division would be : Belle Vue, Berwick, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Newcastle, Redcar, Scunthorpe, Sheffield, Workington. South Division would be : Kings Lynn, Leicester, Poole, Somerset, Swindon, Wolves, Ipswich, Lakeside, Peterborough. Teams in there respective divisions would face each other home and away twice so that would be 16 home meetings but also i would add in that north v south face each other once to create extra fixtures and would also add variety which would be awesome for fans and riders and how it would work is say next year in 2019 Sheffield travel down to Poole, the year after in 2020 Poole would travel to Sheffield. So that is 20/21 home league meetings which would be great value for season tickets, you would see how can fit in KO Cup in and then at end of season the top teams in north and south would be divisional champions and get a trophy and then face each other in a two leg tie for playoff champions, give it all advertising you can and a Super Bowl style finale. I believe this is more radical than a poxy name change they did other year and would help speedway in this country grow, riders would get enough meetings in and if we have to go 5 or 6 riders in a team, create a format that works to make team speedway exactly that again and have a product we can be proud of. This might not be perfect but surely would be better than staying as we are and struggling along.

All speedway TV commentators seem to be on a bonus for every British club they mention.

Hope 'the word' does influence larger crowds - somehow it needs shouted from the proverbial rooftops ??? ....like I said there's only the diehards on here. Regarding £75k............that was the figure a renowned local 'sports person' told me the night of the Diamonds match (mis-match actually).. I still recall the Workington guru Ian Thomas telling us - approx 10 yrs ago- that "the honeymoon isn't over yet"..given that Comets were still attracting 1,200 folk to Derwent Park. And the blind optimist in me still thinks that the sport is capable of another honeymoon at Workington...maybe the upcoming re-structuring during the winter can be the saviour? Meanwhile let's all Comets fans on here get behind the best team in blue and white, Workington style, for years.

We are waiting till you go bust then we'll get a bye to the final! Just banter didn't really mean it

Absolutely nothing but some Aces fans got their knickers in a twist about the Stars potentially changing track conditions at home for a more home advantage. The Aces changed their track conditions and a bit of practice too so a little bit of hypocrisy

Conciliatory/Rosco? Let’s be frank here, he wouldn’t know the definition of conciliatory if it smacked him in the mush!

Nothing at all. I hope Lynn do the same. Silly not to I guess.

I support Rosco in most things regarding the Robins but I think he's got this wrong. I appreciate he's frustrated at losing money over the KO cup but criticising fans for calling this a dead rubber is ill judged. It is a dead rubber, the result changes nothing. Furthermore, I know it's not their fault but the Aces have half their team missing so it's not exactly an attractive event. Why should people fork out another £17 per head to stand about on what is likely to be a cold night. I think if he chose a more conciliatory tone he'd get a better response from supporters.

Thankfully this will be the last GP, maybe just maybe Craig will make it to Derwent Park on a Saturday night to watch his local team bring it home #webelieve

Official prognosis is tapes up about hour from now. I think my estimation above is pretty much on target with that.

Fear of change taking over again and the status quo continues

So Workington... who don’t want to ride Saturdays when there is a GP on because of Craig Cook being in the GP’s and who couldn’t finish their league fixtures at home, now want to ride on a GP Saturday against the team with Craig Cook ahahahahahaha you couldn’t make it up min, suddenly there’s a rush...

Whats wrong with you apart from being a worky fan. We were willing to go to you as requested on 6 October a Saturday night even though you'd all miss watching Cookie on the tele and remember apparently that's why you wanted Friday nights (give me strength). We wanted to hold the second leg as per the rules so to try and speed up things we suggested Sunday the 7th the day after, a day we have ridden on as it is our alternative race day, ask Edinburgh. You don't have a fixture on the 7th and now with his injury we'd be missing our top rider two days running and you are still behaving like a pudding with chips on both shoulders. Do you not realise that acting like this the NL promoters won't want to touch you with a barge pole. If you can't run fixtures due to rider availability, stadium availability, money availability you shouldnt be in a league never mind the championship.

Shut up , what a load of crap you post !!!... get your red-white tinted glasses off , can't see woods for trees you No issue with other teams ?? Peterborough V lakeside not run for a start, and you really think Workington would have not wanted this weekend against you lot, when we would still have been able to get a guest for Dan for both legs ..averages change Monday so it be r/r for him ...Edinburgh had this week in before play-offs came into the equation . I tell you one thing...if Workington can't knock you out the play-offs I hope to hell Peterborough or Lakeside get their hands on the trophy and shut a few up on here !!!

Hello from the studio for the last time this year

Funny that when trying to promote a major event the third tiers rider championship is marketed as the NLRC not the NDLRC!!! The only time the development tag is used is when higher league clubs want a cheap or free signing.

One would assume the timing of BWD's surgery is on the advice of surgeons, so i would just wish him all the best and hope his recovery is a swift one...

They do, Tai won alternative sports person of the year. Maybe 2015, but certainly before bt sports were showing speedway.

http://www.swindonrobins.co/news.php?extend.3181 See Rosco is having a little pop at the lack of support. Putting the blame firmly on the supporters for next year's team already. Unfortunately Alun, this is a pointless meeting for fans to justify passing over their hard earned. As for the last meeting at the current Abbey Stadium, many believe that this could be the last ever Robins home meeting. A little bit of gratitude towards your supporters rather than slagging them off may have gone a little further.

Honestly I can assure you that Workington were not "allowed proper replacement guests that night" as you put it for this rained off meeting. They were going to have to run with National League Guests and Kean Dicken and Kelsey Duggard were lined up to replace Rene Bach at reserve and Nicolai Klindt at Number 1. This was due to the fact that the Danes were both racing in the Polish 2nd Division for which; at that time; no facility was allowed. It is a long story however with the help of that bad man Rob Godfrey (so he is not all that bad then eh!) Workington finally got resolution to the problem that run all the way to the European FIM the day before the Newcastle Workington meeting and Tony Jackson had been given a right royal run around but they finally got a facility for the the two Danes where there were clashes in the fixtures with Poland, due to the assistance of Rob. However this clarification of the situation regarding a facility did not come through until a week and a bit later and after this fixture would have been run so TaylorJ is correct Workington would not have received a facility for this fixture and would have had to run with two NL Guests. Regards THJ

As THJ has pointed out, there's also the wishes of Peterborough, lakeside and Edinburgh to take into consideration...Glasgow are in no other competitions , so seems simple to you to have it when you want ..unfortunately it ain't going to work that way

The way things are going it might not be that"fake".its hard to see the fixtures getting complete in time unless they run them all in the last week.

Honestly The figures I have quoted are pretty near to; if not spot on; the mark (and I do know your man) Even the late great Ian Thomas (a man I liked immensely although not everyone's cup of tea) would struggle with the dilemmas that this promotion are facing, he went through it at Newcastle when he took them up and regretted the actions he took forever and a day. Honestly I am a positive "pot half full" guy but I fear it has gone I can not see a resurgence in any way shape or form I have crunched the numbers for 2019 and it will take a very brave individual to take it on which saddens me greatly. On you last paragraph "Here Here" it is the best team the Comets have had for years and lets see if they can go out with a bang, not just for the fans of Workington but for Laura, Jacko and the whole promotion, including the back room staff, When its gone its gone and it will be dam hard to bring back Regards THJ

Wouldn't know anything about that. What's Brexit?

Honestly You can put a 1 in front of that £75 K singy13 as the cost to run the Comets this year will be in excess of £175 K with a generated income of around £115 K on the original 16 home + 16 away meetings so that is a £60 K shortfall before you turn a wheel (so this is where sponsorship would fill the gap). To cover this cost with paying customers (crowd) alone there needs to be approximately 850 fans through the door and that is at a combined rate of £12.50 per person to allow for concessions, the last two crowds were 391 for the Newcastle meeting and 497 for the Scunthorpe one so working it out on the back of a fag packet those two meetings will have cost the promotion the thick end of a £10 K loss to run over the two meetings. Also the crowd for these two meetings needs to cover the cost of the away legs where Workington performed quite well so riders wages increase because of higher points scored and there is now no contribution against rider costs from the home side as there used to be in the past. The other irony is that the more successful you are as a club the more it costs, teams not reaching semi finals, finals and play offs will obviously lose less money, due to having less meetings, but the Catch 22 on this is if you have a poor team the crowds dwindle so you end up in a spiral of lower crowds, less money to spend on the team, so poorer league position and a cycle that can be hard to break, especially in the current adversarial environment there is between promotions, there is no reward for a successful speedway team as the more meetings you run the more you lose and the "Myth" of these finals and play off meetings generating bigger crowds is just that. However I would expect (surely) the next two home meetings with Glasgow and Edinburgh to bring in a few more fans through the door and swell the numbers on the terraces as both clubs, like Workington; have a healthy travelling contingent who follow their team, but I very much doubt we will see the crowd break 1000 fans with a more realistic figure around the 650 to 700 maximum, but I live in hope and who knows the word may get out in Cumbria and those lost fans from the 70's, 80's and early 90's come flooding back Regards THJ

As does the rider (points money) the promotion and his team mates. Pretty sure if it could have been changed it would have been

Who decides whether the National League should be a development league and nothing else ? Clearly JCookie does not support or go to watch N.L. racing. At ANY level there will always be teams at the top and teams at the bottom. Every N.L. club is a business just like those at a higher level. Does Jcookie think that all the investment made and work done will be worth it to see very low standards ? He is deluded...in fact, the higher the standard of the 3rd tier, the better class of rider will be produced. THAT is a FACT and it is ignored by the BSPA who seem not to understand the sport they operate. Way back in history ( can't quite remember the actual date) the 2nd league broke away from the Control Board and ran, I think, very successfully. I can see the same thing happening again with the N.L. breaking away from the BSPA. And who could blame them ?

Oooh, you bitch!!!!

No need to be apologetic at all. You have got the point well and used a good hypothetical analogy to express it. I offer no hope that this will be understood by the same old faces who have been spouting their nonsense for years.

The NL should be a development league and nothing else. The fact that there's around 50 points between top and bottom just says it all. The likes of Mildenhall, Kent & Birmingham have no place in what should be a development league

Stars 40-50 Aces

It would actually cost a few thousand ...

I’d always rather go into a meeting with seven riders rather than six, especially one in the Play Offs.

I need something to make me stronger after reading all the crap posted by Shovlar & Starman tonight

And so it rumbles on with still no word on when the Glasgow v Workington semi final takes place . It really should be this weekend as the league title should take precedence over cup competitions , but since the Edinburgh v Worky cup semi is already penciled in for then , then it should be the same as the Peterborough v Lakeside semi which is the 6th and 7th of October . And yes i know we wont have our best rider , but so what ? If you sign a rider with all sorts of other commitments, then you have to expect and be prepared for fixture clashes . No wonder the sport in this country is in such a mess when the governing body allow the clubs to decide when they want to race . The four clubs should be told both semi finals are on the weekend of the 5th , 6th and 7th of October with the final the following weekend , deal with it .

Ronnie Russell said it will be similar to the Melbourne GP track. As I said previously I believe it was almost a “D” shape...recall it to allow for good racing. As many have said, the track can be changed even without any improvements to the “stadium”. A change to the Abbey track will only be a good thing IMO, a smaller track with wider straights will make for better racing.

I'm not sure if you're deliberately trying to be provocative, but no way would Martin Ashby be a 7.5 man. He was out and out number one for many years. He'd easily get above 8 using the current format, which is where number ones are mainly. Whatever the format, he'd still have been the number one.

In recent separate conversations with a referee and someone working for Bt Sport... one said Belle Vue is the best track in the UK by a long way and the other described it as the best track in the world. Yes we are so lucky to have the NSS track. one point aside , when Ivan Mauger attended the Gorton Monastery meeting re the possibility of a new track, he spoke eloquently as expected but the one thing that stuck out was that he said” Whatever happens make sure you use good quality shale on the track” some British promoters could do with heeding that advice